Saturday, September 27, 2008

വഴിമുട്ടിയ വാള്‍സ്ട്രീറ്റ്

ന്യൂ യോര്‍ക്ക് നഗരത്തിന്റെ ചിത്രം കണ്ടിട്ടുള്ള ഏതൊരാളുടെയും ശ്രദ്ധയാകര്‍ഷിച്ചിരിക്കുക അംബരചുംബിയായ കൂറ്റന്‍ കെട്ടിടനിരയാണ്. ഇതില്‍ ഏറ്റവും ഉയരം കൂടിയവ വാള്‍സ്ട്രീറ്റിലാണ്. അല്‍ഖായ്‌ദ തകര്‍ത്ത വേള്‍ഡ് ട്രേഡ് സെന്ററിന്റെ ഇരട്ടക്കെട്ടിടവും ഈ റോഡിലായിരുന്നു. വാള്‍സ്ട്രീറ്റ് അമേരിക്കന്‍ മൂലധനത്തിന്റെ ആസ്ഥാനമായിട്ടാണ് കരുതുന്നത്. ന്യൂയോര്‍ക്ക് സ്റ്റോക്ക് എക്സ്ചേഞ്ച് ഇവിടെയാണ്. അമേരിക്കന്‍ ഓഹരിക്കമ്പോളത്തിന്റെ പ്രസിദ്ധസൂചികകളായ നിക്കി, നാസ്‌ഡാക്ക് തുടങ്ങിയവയുടെയെല്ലാം ആസ്ഥാനം ഇവിടെത്തന്നെ. പിന്നെ അമേരിക്കന്‍ ഭീമന്‍ ബാങ്കുകളായ മെറില്‍ലിഞ്ച്, ലേ മാന്‍, ഗോള്‍ഡ്‌മാന്‍ സാച്ചസ്, സ്റ്റാന്‍ലി മോര്‍ഗന്‍ തുടങ്ങിയവയുടെയെല്ലാം ആസ്ഥാനവും ഇവിടെത്തന്നെ. വാള്‍സ്ട്രീറ്റ് തുമ്മിയാല്‍ ലോകത്തിന് പനി പിടിക്കും എന്ന ഒരു ചൊല്ലുതന്നെയുണ്ട്.

പക്ഷേ വാള്‍സ്ട്രീറ്റ് ഇന്ന് മൂകതയിലാണ്. പ്രതിസന്ധിയുടെ ആദ്യഘട്ടത്തില്‍ ഭവന പണയബാങ്കുകളാണ് തകര്‍ന്നതെങ്കില്‍ ഇപ്പോള്‍ ഊഴം ഭീമന്‍ ഇന്‍‌വെസ്റ്റ്മെന്റ് ബാങ്കുകളുടേതാണ്. മുകളില്‍ പരാമര്‍ശിച്ച ഭീമന്മാരെല്ലാം നിക്ഷേപബാങ്കുകളാണ്. ഇവയ്ക്ക് വാണിജ്യ ബാങ്കുകളെപ്പോലെ സേവിങ്സ് ബാങ്ക് അക്കൌണ്ടുകളോ സാധാരണഗതിയിലുള്ള ബാങ്കിങ് പ്രവര്‍ത്തനമോ ഇല്ല. ഫണ്ട് സമാഹരിക്കുന്നത് ബോണ്ട് അഥവാ കടപ്പത്രം ഇറക്കിയാണ്. ഇപ്രകാരം സമാഹരിക്കുന്ന പണം ഉപയോഗിച്ച് നിക്ഷേപ ബാങ്കുകള്‍ ഷെയര്‍ മാര്‍ക്കറ്റിലും വിദേശ വിനിമയ കമ്പോളത്തിലും മറ്റും ഊഹക്കച്ചവടം നടത്തുന്നു. ഇങ്ങനെയാണ് ഇവര്‍ ലാഭം ഉണ്ടാക്കുന്നത്.

നിക്ഷേപബാങ്കിന്റെ ഒരു സുപ്രധാന മേഖലയായിരുന്നു സബ്പ്രൈം മാര്‍ക്കറ്റ്. ഭൂമിയുടെയും പാര്‍പ്പിടത്തിനും മേലുള്ള ഊഹക്കച്ചവടം മൂലം അവയുടെ വില കുത്തനെ ഉയര്‍ന്നു. ഈ മോഹവിലയെ അടിസ്ഥാനമാക്കി വീട് പണയമായി സ്വീകരിച്ച് ഭവനപണയ ബാങ്ക് ഉദാരമായി വായ്പ നല്‍കി. ഭൂമിയുടെയും വീടിന്റെയും വില ഒരിക്കലും താഴില്ലെന്നായിരുന്നു പൊതുധാരണ. അതുകൊണ്ട് വായ്പക്കാരന്റെ തിരിച്ചടവു കഴിവിനെക്കുറിച്ച് അത്രയേറെ തലപുകയ്ക്കേണ്ട ആവശ്യമില്ലെന്നതായിരുന്നു ഭവനപണയ ബാങ്കിന്റെ സമീപനം.

ഭവനപണയ ബാങ്ക് തങ്ങളുടെ പണയമെല്ലാം പ്രത്യേക പാക്കേജാക്കി നിക്ഷേപ ബാങ്കിന് വില്‍ക്കുന്നു. ഇതിന് സെക്യൂരിറ്റൈസേഷന്‍ എന്നാണ് വിളിക്കുന്നത്. ഭവനപണയ ബാങ്കിന് പണം സമാഹരിക്കുന്നതിന് ഈടായി ലഭിച്ച ഭൂമിയോ വീടോ കൈമാറേണ്ടതില്ല. മറിച്ച് ഇവയുടെ പണയം പാക്കേജാക്കി ന്യായമായ ഒരു ഡിസ്കൌണ്ടിന് മറിച്ചുവില്‍ക്കുകയാണ്. എന്തിന് നിക്ഷേപ ബാങ്ക് ഇങ്ങനെ പണയം ഏറ്റെടുക്കണം? കാരണം ലളിതമാണ്. വായ്പയില്‍നിന്നുള്ള പലിശയാണ് അവരുടെ വരുമാനം. വായ്പ നല്‍കാന്‍ പണം സമാഹരിക്കാന്‍ അവര്‍ക്ക് പ്രയാസമില്ല. കടപ്പത്രം എത്ര ഇറക്കിയാലും വാങ്ങാന്‍ ആളുണ്ടല്ലോ.

കുറെ കഴിഞ്ഞപ്പോള്‍ പുതിയ ഒരു പ്രവണതകൂടി പ്രത്യക്ഷപ്പെട്ടു. നിക്ഷേപബാങ്ക് വാങ്ങുന്ന പണയ സെക്യൂരിറ്റീസ് അവരും മറിച്ചു വില്‍ക്കാന്‍ തുടങ്ങി. ഇങ്ങനെ സബ്പ്രൈം മാര്‍ക്കറ്റ് എന്ന കമ്പോളം ഉണ്ടായി. ഭവനപണയ ബാങ്ക് പൊളിഞ്ഞുതുടങ്ങിയതോടെ സബ്പ്രൈം മാര്‍ക്കറ്റിന്റെ വിശ്വാസ്യതയ്ക്ക് ഇളക്കം തട്ടി. നിക്ഷേപബാങ്ക് ഇറക്കിയ ബോണ്ടും സെക്യുരിറ്റിയും മറ്റു ധനസ്ഥാപനങ്ങള്‍ക്കും ഇടപാടുകാര്‍ക്കും കൈവെടിയാന്‍ വെപ്രാളമായി. എല്ലാവര്‍ക്കും കൈയിലുള്ള കടപ്പത്രം വിറ്റഴിക്കണം. പക്ഷേ, വാങ്ങാന്‍ ആളില്ല. ഇതിന്റെ ഫലമായി കടപ്പപത്രത്തിന്റെയും മറ്റും വില കുത്തനെ ഇടിയാന്‍ തുടങ്ങി. നിക്ഷേപബാങ്കിന്റെ ഓഹരിവിലയും ഇടിഞ്ഞു.

ഈ ബാങ്ക് പൊളിയുന്നത് അനുവദിക്കാന്‍ അമേരിക്കന്‍ സര്‍ക്കാരിന് കഴിയില്ല. ലേമാന്റെ തകര്‍ച്ച ലോകത്തെമ്പാടുമുള്ള സ്റ്റോക്ക് എക്സ്ചേഞ്ചിനെ പ്രകമ്പനംകൊള്ളിച്ചു. മുംബൈ സ്റ്റോക്ക് എക്സ്ചേഞ്ചില്‍പ്പോലും അഞ്ചു ശതമാനം വില ഇടിഞ്ഞു. ലേമാനെ തുടര്‍ന്ന് എഐജി എന്ന ഇന്‍ഷുറന്‍സ് ഭീമന്‍കൂടി തകര്‍ന്നാല്‍ കാര്യങ്ങള്‍ കൈവിട്ടുപോകുമെന്ന ഭീതി പടര്‍ന്നു. അതിനാലാണ് അമേരിക്കന്‍ സര്‍ക്കാര്‍ 4000 കോടി ഡോളര്‍ സഹായംകൊടുത്ത് ബാങ്ക് ഓഫ് അമേരിക്കയെക്കൊണ്ട് എഐജിയെ വിലയ്ക്കെടുപ്പിച്ചത്.

അപ്പോഴേക്കും അര്‍ബുദം ധനമേഖലയില്‍ ആകെ പടര്‍ന്നെന്ന് വ്യക്തമായി. വാള്‍സ്ട്രീറ്റിലെ മറ്റു പല പ്രധാന ബാങ്കും ആടിത്തുടങ്ങി. അവയില്‍ ചിലതെങ്കിലും തകര്‍ന്നാല്‍ കടപ്പത്രകമ്പോളത്തിലെ കുഴപ്പം ഓഹരിക്കമ്പോളത്തിലേക്കും കടന്നേക്കാം. ഫലം വിനാശകരമാകും.

ഒന്നോ രണ്ടോ ബാങ്കിനെ രക്ഷിച്ചതുകൊണ്ട് കമ്പോളത്തിന്റെ വിശ്വാസത്തകര്‍ച്ച ദൂരീകരിക്കാനാകില്ല. ഏത് ബാങ്ക് പൊളിഞ്ഞാലും താങ്ങായി തങ്ങള്‍ ഇടപെടും എന്ന വ്യക്തമായ സന്ദേശം നല്‍കാന്‍ അമേരിക്കന്‍സര്‍ക്കാര്‍ തീരുമാനിച്ചു. ഇതിനായി നിക്ഷേപ ബാങ്കിന്റെ കടപ്പത്രം വലിയ തോതില്‍ വാങ്ങാന്‍ അമേരിക്കന്‍സര്‍ക്കാര്‍ തന്നെ തയ്യാറായിരിക്കുകയാണ്. 70,000 കോടി ഡോളറാണ് ഇതിനായി നീക്കിവച്ചിരിക്കുന്നത്.

അമേരിക്കന്‍ ഫെഡറല്‍ റിസര്‍വ് ബാങ്കിന്റെ ചെയര്‍മാന്‍ ബെന്‍ എസ് ബെര്‍ണാകെയും ട്രഷറി സെക്രട്ടറി ഹെന്‍‌റി പോള്‍സണും കൂടിയാണ് ഈ രക്ഷാ പാക്കേജിന് രൂപംനല്‍കിയത്. ഇപ്പോള്‍ പ്രഖ്യാപിച്ചിരിക്കുന്ന പാക്കേജിനോടൊപ്പം ഇതിനകം എഐജി, ഫാനിമേ, ഫ്രെഡിമാക്ക് എന്നിവയെ രക്ഷിക്കുന്നതിനായി നല്‍കിയ പണവും കൂടി ചേര്‍ത്താല്‍ ഒരുലക്ഷം കോടി രൂപയാണ് നിക്ഷേപബാങ്കിനെ രക്ഷിക്കാന്‍ അമേരിക്കന്‍സര്‍ക്കാര്‍ ചെലവഴിക്കുന്നത്. എന്നു മാത്രമല്ല മറ്റ് യൂറോപ്യന്‍ കോയ്മകളെക്കൂടി ഇത്തരത്തിലുള്ള പാക്കേജ് പ്രഖ്യാപിക്കുന്നതിന് അമേരിക്ക പ്രേരിപ്പിക്കുകയാണ്.

എന്നാല്‍, ചരിത്രത്തിലെ ഏറ്റവും വലിയ ധനരക്ഷാ പാക്കേജിന് അമേരിക്കന്‍ സെനറ്റില്‍ അപ്രതീക്ഷിതമായ എതിര്‍പ്പ് ഉണ്ടായിരിക്കുകയാണ്. സെനറ്റ് നിയമം പാസാക്കിയാലേ പണം ചെലവഴിക്കാന്‍ കഴിയൂ. അമേരിക്കന്‍ നിയമനിര്‍മാണസഭയ്‌ക്കു പോലും ദഹിക്കാന്‍ പ്രയാസമുള്ള കടുത്ത നിര്‍ദേശമാണ് രക്ഷാ പാക്കേജിലുള്ളതെന്നു സാരം.

എഴുപതിനായിരം കോടി ഡോളറെന്നാല്‍ അമേരിക്കയുടെ സാമൂഹ്യസുരക്ഷാ ചെലവിനേക്കാള്‍ ഉയര്‍ന്നതാണ്. നിയോ ലിബറല്‍ ആദര്‍ശത്തെപ്പിടിച്ച് ആണയിട്ട് രണ്ടു ദശാബ്‌ദമായി ക്ഷേമച്ചെലവും സബ്‌സിഡിയുമെല്ലാം വെട്ടിച്ചുരുക്കുകയായിരുന്നല്ലോ. തൊഴിലാളികളുടെ യഥാര്‍ഥകൂലി കഴിഞ്ഞ ഒരു ദശാബ്‌ദത്തിലേറെയായി ഉയര്‍ന്നിട്ടില്ല. എന്നുവച്ചാല്‍ വളര്‍ച്ചയുടെ നേട്ടമെല്ലാം മുതലാളിമാരുടെയും ഊഹക്കച്ചവടക്കാരുടെയും കൈയിലാണ് ചെന്നുചേര്‍ന്നത്. ഇപ്പോള്‍ ഇവരുടെ ദുഷ്‌ചെയ്‌തിക്ക് സര്‍ക്കാര്‍ സബ്‌സിഡി നല്‍കാന്‍ പോവുകയാണ്. ബാങ്കില്‍ത്തന്നെ വിശ്വാസവഞ്ചന കാണിച്ചവര്‍ക്ക് സഹായം. കരുതലോടെ പ്രവര്‍ത്തിച്ചവര്‍ക്കു സഹായമില്ല. ഇത് അധാര്‍മികമാണെന്നാണ് ചില സെനറ്റര്‍മാരുടെ വാദം. ഇതുവരെ ഉദ്ഘോഷിച്ച സര്‍വസ്വതന്ത്രതയുടെയും സര്‍ക്കാര്‍ പിന്‍വാങ്ങലിന്റെയും നിയോ ലിബറല്‍ ആദര്‍ശത്തെ ഈ ശുദ്ധാത്മാക്കള്‍ ഇപ്പോഴും മുറുകെ പിടിക്കുകയാണ്.

രക്ഷാ പാക്കേജിലുള്ള ഭീമമായ തുക ചെലവഴിക്കുന്നതിന് സര്‍വസ്വാതന്ത്ര്യവും വേണമെന്നാണ് ട്രഷറി സെക്രട്ടറി ഹെന്‍‌റി പോള്‍സണ്‍ ആവശ്യപ്പെടുന്നത്. അത്രയ്ക്ക് അസാധാരണമായ സ്ഥിതിവിശേഷമാണ് നിലവിലുള്ളതെന്നാണ് അദ്ദേഹത്തിന്റെ അഭിപ്രായം. ഏതെങ്കിലും സര്‍ക്കാര്‍ ഏജന്‍സി വഴിയല്ല രക്ഷാപ്രവര്‍ത്തനം നടത്താന്‍ പോകുന്നത്. തെരഞ്ഞെടുത്ത ബാങ്കുകളുടെ ഒരു കണ്‍സോര്‍ഷ്യം രൂപീകരിച്ച് അവരായിരിക്കണം കമ്പോളത്തില്‍ ഇടപെടേണ്ടത് എന്നാണ് ഹെന്റി പോള്‍സണിന്റെ അഭിപ്രായം. ഇപ്പോള്‍ അടിപതറുന്ന ഗോള്‍ഡ്‌മാന്‍ സാച്ചസിന്റെ മേധാവിയായിരുന്നു ദീര്‍ഘകാലം ഹെന്റി പോള്‍സണ്‍ ! ഫാനിമേയെയും ഫ്രെഡിമാക്കിനെയും തകര്‍ച്ചയില്‍നിന്നു രക്ഷിക്കാന്‍ ഷെയര്‍ മുഴുവന്‍ സര്‍ക്കാര്‍ ഏറ്റെടുക്കുകയായിരുന്നല്ലോ. പക്ഷേ, അത് ഉടമസ്ഥത സര്‍ക്കാരിലേക്കു മാറ്റും. ഇതു ദേശസാല്‍ക്കരണത്തിനു തുല്യമാണ്. അതുകൊണ്ട് തകരുന്ന ബാങ്കിന്റെ ഷെയറല്ല അവര്‍ ഇറക്കിയിട്ടുള്ള കള്ള കടപ്പത്രമായിരിക്കും ഇനി സര്‍ക്കാര്‍ വാങ്ങുക. എങ്ങനെയിരിക്കുന്നു പാക്കേജ്?

സെനറ്റിലെ എതിര്‍പ്പിനെ മറികടക്കാന്‍ പ്രസിഡന്റ് ബുഷ് തന്നെ രംഗപ്രവേശംചെയ്തു. ദേശീയ വിപത്തിന്റെ കാലത്തെന്നപോലെ അമേരിക്കന്‍ ജനങ്ങളോട് ടെലിവിഷനിലൂടെ പരസ്യ അഭ്യര്‍ഥന നടത്തിയിരിക്കുകയാണ് ബുഷ്. റിപ്പബ്ളിക്കന്‍ സ്ഥാനാര്‍ഥി മക്കെയിനും ഡെമോക്രാറ്റിക് സ്ഥാനാര്‍ഥി ബരാക് ഒബാമയും ഒരുമിച്ച് പ്രസ്താവനയിറക്കി. സ്ഥിതിവിശേഷം എത്ര ഗൌരവമാണെന്നതിനുള്ള ചൂണ്ടുപലകയാണ് ഇവയെല്ലാം.

ഏതായാലും കമ്പോളത്തിന് നിക്ഷേപബാങ്കിനെ വിശ്വാസം വരുന്നില്ല. എല്ലാം ഭദ്രമാണെന്നും കെങ്കേമന്മാരാണ് തങ്ങളെന്നും പറഞ്ഞു വിശ്വസിപ്പിച്ചതെല്ലാം പൊളിഞ്ഞു. ഇനി എന്തെല്ലാം മറച്ചുവച്ചിട്ടുണ്ടാകും എന്നാണ് ഇടപാടുകാര്‍ സംശയിക്കുന്നത്. ഗോള്‍ഡന്‍ സാച്ചസും മോര്‍ഗന്‍ സ്റ്റാന്‍ലിയും അവസാനത്തെ ഒരു അടവ് എടുത്ത് പ്രയോഗിച്ചു. തങ്ങളെ വാണിജ്യ ബാങ്കുകളായി കണക്കാക്കണം എന്ന് അവര്‍ അമേരിക്കന്‍ ഫെഡറല്‍ റിസര്‍വ് ബാങ്കിന് അപേക്ഷ നല്‍കി. സാധാരണ വാണിജ്യ ബാങ്കായി മാറിയാല്‍ ഒരു ഗുണമുണ്ട്: ജനങ്ങളില്‍നിന്ന് ഡിപ്പോസിറ്റ് സ്വീകരിക്കാം. പക്ഷേ, അതിനുപരി മറ്റെല്ലാ ബാങ്കിനെയുംപോലെ ഇവര്‍ രണ്ടും ഫെഡറല്‍ റിസര്‍വ് ബാങ്കിന്റെ മേല്‍നോട്ടത്തില്‍ വരും. 1996 ല്‍ പ്രത്യേക നിയമംമൂലം നിക്ഷേപബാങ്കിനെ ഫെഡറല്‍ റിസര്‍വിന്റെ നിയന്ത്രണത്താളില്‍നിന്നും മേല്‍നോട്ടത്തില്‍നിന്നും സര്‍വസ്വതന്ത്രമാക്കിയിരുന്നു. ഈ സൌകര്യം ഉപയോഗിച്ച് തിരിമറി നടത്തിയതാണ് ബാങ്കുകള്‍ ഈ പതനത്തില്‍ എത്തിച്ചേരാന്‍ കാരണം. ഇനിമേല്‍ രഹസ്യ ഏര്‍പ്പാടൊന്നും ഉണ്ടാകില്ല. റിസര്‍വ് ബാങ്കിന്റെ ലക്ഷ്മണരേഖയ്ക്കുള്ളില്‍ത്തന്നെ നിന്നുകൊള്ളാമെന്ന് ജനങ്ങളോട് ഏറ്റുപറയുകയാണ് മോര്‍ഗന്‍ സ്റ്റാന്‍ലിയും ഗോള്‍ഡ്‌മാന്‍ സാച്ചസും.

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ഡോ. ടി എം തോമസ് ഐസക്

70 comments:

വര്‍ക്കേഴ്സ് ഫോറം said...

ഗോള്‍ഡന്‍ സാച്ചസും മോര്‍ഗന്‍ സ്റ്റാന്‍ലിയും അവസാനത്തെ അടവ് എടുത്ത് പ്രയോഗിക്കുകയാണ്. തങ്ങളെ വാണിജ്യ ബാങ്കുകളായി കണക്കാക്കണം എന്ന് അവര്‍ അമേരിക്കന്‍ ഫെഡറല്‍ റിസര്‍വ് ബാങ്കിന് അപേക്ഷ നല്‍കി. വാണിജ്യ ബാങ്കായി മാറിയാല്‍ ഒരു ഗുണമുണ്ട്: ജനങ്ങളില്‍നിന്ന് ഡിപ്പോസിറ്റ് സ്വീകരിക്കാം. പക്ഷേ, അതിനുപരി മറ്റെല്ലാ ബാങ്കിനെയുംപോലെ ഇവര്‍ രണ്ടും ഫെഡറല്‍ റിസര്‍വ് ബാങ്കിന്റെ മേല്‍നോട്ടത്തില്‍ വരും.

1996 ല്‍ പ്രത്യേക നിയമംമൂലം നിക്ഷേപബാങ്കിനെ ഫെഡറല്‍ റിസര്‍വിന്റെ നിയന്ത്രണത്താളില്‍നിന്നും മേല്‍നോട്ടത്തില്‍നിന്നും സര്‍വസ്വതന്ത്രമാക്കിയിരുന്നു. ഈ സൌകര്യം ഉപയോഗിച്ച് തിരിമറി നടത്തിയതാണ് ബാങ്കുകള്‍ ഈ പതനത്തില്‍ എത്തിച്ചേരാന്‍ കാരണം. ഇനിമേല്‍ രഹസ്യ ഏര്‍പ്പാടൊന്നും ഉണ്ടാകില്ല. റിസര്‍വ് ബാങ്കിന്റെ ലക്ഷ്മണരേഖയ്ക്കുള്ളില്‍ത്തന്നെ നിന്നുകൊള്ളാമെന്ന് ജനങ്ങളോട് ഏറ്റുപറയുകയാണ് മോര്‍ഗന്‍ സ്റ്റാന്‍ലിയും ഗോള്‍ഡ്‌മാന്‍ സാച്ചസും.

അമേരിക്കന്‍ സാമ്പത്തിക പ്രതിസന്ധിയെ മുന്‍‌നിറുത്തി ഡോ. ടി.എം.തോമസ് ഐസക്ക് ദേശാഭിമാനിയില്‍ എഴുതിയ ലേഖനം.

അതുല്യ said...

ലോക പോലീസ് കളിച്ച് കളിച്ച് സ്വന്തം പറമ്പിലെ തേങ കട്ടോണ്ട് പോയത് അവരു കണ്ടില്ല. ഇങനെ പോയാല്‍ അവിടം വേറെ ഒരു ബീഹാറാവും വേഗം.

Anonymous said...

look at this bitch. She works in investment banking. Watch out.....

Baiju Elikkattoor said...

Mind your words you coward! You are just like a typical mallu who scribles his mind's rot on public toilet walls. Come out bloody stupid! You can oppose a policy or an ideology. How can you insult a lady who put across her independent comment? It is her choice to work wherever she would like! Would you call like this if somebody from your family works in an investment bank?

വര്‍ക്കേഴ്സ് ഫോറം said...

ബൈജു
നന്ദി
സന്ദര്‍ഭോചിതമായ ഇടപെടലിന്.
അനോനിമസ്
താങ്കളാരായാലും
ഇതു വളരെ മോശമായി പോയി
അതുല്യാമ്മ
വായനയ്ക്കും അഭിപ്രായങ്ങള്‍ക്കും ഒത്തിരി നന്ദിയുണ്ട്

Aarushi said...

American economy is mother of all economies, they will overcome this by hiking taxes or putting hands in other economies, everyone was aware of this gamble, this happened only because the oil price increased and defaulters didnt pay at least what expected by sub prime.

They have given loans to those have nots or not that creditworthy people which caused problem. Cant we see this like a communist or humanist act, how much money we are wasting like this in the name of Janakeeyasoothranam, now Panchayat member makes how much money from such raod making, latrine construction for SC/ST, for only one latrine he takes loan again and again and commission goes to Panchayat member. Similary bak employees are forced to give eduation loans to anyone who approach, whithout any guarantee of getting back.

I DONT UNDERSTAND WHY THOMAS ISSAC IS SO HAPPY ABOUT THE PROBLEM IN AMERICAN ECONOMY, cant you understand that it may cause te out sourcing works, our Indians working there, their families, the money they send to Kerala etc. Any fall in economy even in Mars planet will affect Kerala as we have a man there and he sends money to Kerala and thats why we are surviving today.

The root cause is the defaulters didnt pay, as simple as that, they were poor most of them blacks, who never have a track record of paying back. If American banks were conservative in selecting the loanees this will not happen. Whats there to laugh about this, I dont understand.

Baiju Elikkattoor said...

"Whats there to laugh about this, I dont understand."

Yes, Arushi you don't really understand. Your comment reflects that. It is nice to see that you have admitted it! Well!!

വര്‍ക്കേഴ്സ് ഫോറം said...

തുടക്കം മുതലേ പിഴച്ചു ആരുഷീ

എല്ലാ സമ്പദ്‌വ്യവസ്ഥയുടേയും അമ്മയാണോ അമേരിക്കന്‍ സമ്പദ്‌വ്യവസ്ഥ? ആരാണ് അമ്മയാക്കിയത്? പക്ഷെ താങ്കള്‍ പറഞ്ഞപോലെ സാധാരണക്കാരായ അമേരിക്കന്‍ പൌരന്മാരുടെ പുറത്ത് നികുതി ഭാരം അടിച്ചേല്‍പ്പിക്കാതെ തീവെട്ടിക്കൊള്ള നടത്തിയ ഈ വമ്പന്‍‌ ഇന്‍‌വെസ്റ്റ്മെറ്റ് കമ്പനികളെ രക്ഷിച്ചെടുക്കാനാവില്ല. ഇന്‍‌വെസ്റ്റ്മെന്റ് കമ്പനികള്‍ ബാങ്കായി മാറാന്‍ ആഗ്രഹിക്കുന്നു, ഫേഡറല്‍ റിസര്‍വിന്റെ മേല്‍നോട്ടത്തിന്‍ കീഴില്‍ വരാന്‍ ആഗ്രഹിക്കുന്നു എന്നുള്ളതിന്റെ, പ്രത്യേകത താങ്കള്‍ക്ക് മനസ്സിലാകുന്നില്ലെന്നോ?

താങ്കള്‍ പറഞ്ഞ രണ്ടാമത്തെ പോയിന്റിനോട് വിയോജിപ്പുണ്ട്. എണ്ണ വിലയുമായി ബന്ധപ്പെട്ടതാണിത്..രണ്ടു മാസത്തെ ചെറിയ കാലയളവില്‍ എണ്ണ വില എങ്ങനെ ബാരലിനു 143 ഡോളറില്‍ നിന്ന് 90 ഡോളറായി എന്നു താങ്കള്‍ ചിന്തിച്ചിട്ടുണ്ടോ? യ്ഥാര്‍ത്ഥത്തില്‍ വമ്പന്‍ ധനകാര്യകോര്‍പ്പറേഷനുകളല്ലേ ഇക്കാര്യത്തിലും വില്ലന്‍? മോര്‍ട്ട്‌ഗേജ് പ്രതിസന്ധിയില്‍ അടി പറ്റിയ അമേരിക്കന്‍ ധനകാര്യ ഊഹക്കച്ചവടക്കാരല്ലേ എണ്ണയുടെ വില 143 ഡോളര്‍ വരെ എത്തിച്ചത്. അങ്ങനെയല്ലേ അവര്‍ താല്‍ക്കാലികമായി പ്രതിസന്ധി മറികടന്നത്? പ്ക്ഷെ അത് നീണ്ടു നിന്നില്ല എന്നത് അനുഭവം. ആ വിലക്കയറ്റം ഇന്ത്യയുള്‍പ്പെടെയുള്ള രാജ്യങ്ങളിലെ സാധാരണ ജനങ്ങളുടെ ചുമലിലേക്ക് ഇറക്കി വയ്ക്കുകയായിരുന്നില്ലേ അവര്‍ ചെയ്തത്...എന്നു വച്ചാല്‍ തങ്ങള്‍ മോര്‍ട്ട്ഗേജ് വ്യാപാരത്തിലൂടെ നഷ്ടമാക്കിയത് എണ്ണ വില വര്‍ദ്ധനയിലൂടെ വീണ്ടെടുക്കയായിരുന്നില്ലേ..? അങ്ങനെ നോക്കുമ്പോള്‍ നവയാഥാസ്ഥിതിക വാദികള്‍ വാദിക്കുന്ന ഉദാരവല്‍ക്കരണ നയങ്ങള്‍ മൂലം ഇന്ത്യയിലെ സാധാരണക്കാര്‍ക്ക് ലാഭമുണ്ടാകുന്നില്ല എന്നു മാത്രമല്ല , ലോക മുതലാളിത്ത പ്രതിസന്ധിയുടെ ഭാരം വഹിക്കാന്‍ അവര്‍ നിര്‍ബന്ധിതരാവുക കൂടിയല്ലേ യഥാര്‍ത്ഥത്തില്‍ സംഭവിക്കുന്നത്?

നവലിബറല്‍ നയങ്ങള്‍ എന്തുകൊണ്ട് പരാജയപ്പെടുന്നു എന്നു പറയേണ്ട എന്നാണോ? അതിന് ബദല്‍ നയങ്ങള്‍ രൂപീകരിക്കേണ്ട എന്നാണോ താങ്കള്‍ പറയുന്നത്?

താങ്കള്‍ പറയുന്ന പോലെ ഡീഫോള്‍ട്ട് അല്ല പ്രശ്നം, എന്തു കൊണ്ട് ഡീഫോള്‍ട്ട് എന്നതാണ് പ്രശ്നം. ഇതിനു മുമ്പ് ഈ ബ്ലോഗില്‍ തന്നെ ഇതിനെക്കുറിച്ച് എത്രയോ പ്രാവശ്യം വിശദീകരിച്ചു കഴിഞ്ഞു. ഇനിയും വയ്യ.സദയം ക്ഷമിക്കുക.

അനംഗാരി said...

ആരുഷീ മോനെ കുമാരാ...കണ്ണടച്ച് ഇരുട്ടാക്കാതെ...
എന്തുകൊണ്ട് സാധാരണക്കാരായ ആളുകൾക്ക് വായ്പ തിരിച്ചടക്കാൻ പറ്റുന്നില്ല എന്ന് ചിന്തിച്ചിട്ടുണ്ടോ? കുറെ സോഫ്റ്റ് വെയര് എഞ്ചിനീയർമാരുടെ ലോകമല്ല അമേരിക്ക.ലോക വിപണിയിലെ വിലക്കയറ്റം മൂലം സാധാരണക്കാരായവരുടെ വരുമാനത്തിന്റെ നല്ലൊരു പങ്കും,അത്യാവശ്യ കാര്യങ്ങൾക്ക് പോലും തികയുന്നില്ല എന്നതാണ് സ്ഥിതി.
താങ്കൾക്കെന്താ കറുത്തവർ മോശക്കാരാണ് എന്ന ചിന്താഗതി? അവര് കേൾക്കണ്ട. നിങ്ങളെ പോലുള്ളവരാണ് കുഴപ്പക്കാർ.
കാര്യങ്ങൾ പഠിച്ചിട്ട് സംസാരിക്ക്...

kaalidaasan said...

ആരുഷി പറയുന്നത് വെറും വിഡ്ഡിത്തം . പിന്നെ അന്ധമായ അമേരിക്കന്‍ ഭക്തികൊണ്ട് അമേരിക്കയാണ്‌ ലോക സമ്പദ് വ്യവസ്ഥയുടെ അമ്മയെന്നോ അച്ചനെന്നോ ഒക്കെ പറയാം . സമ്പദ് വ്യവസ്ഥ തകര്‍ന്നു എന്നു കരുതി അമേരിക്ക തകരുകയൊന്നുമില്ല. അവര്‍ കര കയറും . അതിനു വേണ്ടി ടാക്സ് കൂട്ടിയേക്കാം , മറ്റു സമ്പദ് വ്യവസ്ഥകളില്‍ കയ്യിട്ടു വാരിയേക്കാം .

ഈ നഷ്ടം ഉണ്ടാക്കി തകര്‍ന്നു പോയ കോര്‍പ്പറേറ്റ് ഭീമന്‍ മാരുടെ സാരഥികളെല്ലാം കയ്യിലാക്കിയ ശമ്പളം എത്രയാണെന്നു ആരുഷിക്കെന്തെങ്കിലും വിവരമുണ്ടോ?

ഡിഫോള്‍ട്ടേര്‍സ് പണം കൊടുത്തില്ല എന്നും എണ്ണ വില കൂടി എന്നും പറയുന്നത് മണ്ടത്തരമെന്നേ പറയാവൂ. ബ്രിട്ടനില്‍ തകര്‍ന്ന നോര്‍ തേണ്‍ റോക്ക് എന്ന ബാങ്ക് 120% വരെ മോര്‍ ട്ട്ഗേജ് കൊടുത്തിരുന്നു. എന്നു വച്ചാല്‍ യധാര്‍ത്ഥ വിലയുടെ 120% വരെ എന്ന്. ഏതു സാമ്പത്തിക ശാസ്ത്ര മനദണ്ധം വച്ച് അതിനെ ന്യായീകരിക്കാന്‍ പറ്റും ? എണ്ണ വില കൂട്ടിയത് ഉത്പാദകരോ വിതരണക്കാരോ അല്ല, ഇടനിലക്കാരാണ്. യതൊരു നിയന്ത്രണവുമില്ലാത്ത വ്യവസ്ഥയില്‍ ഇതൊക്കെ നടക്കും . മുതലാളിത്ത വ്യവസ്ഥയുടെ ഏറ്റവും വൃത്തികെട്ട മുഖമാണിന്ന് അമേരിക്കയില്‍ കാണുന്നത്.


യധാര്‍ത്ഥ വിലയുടെ 120% പണയപ്പണയായി കൊടുത്തിരുന്നു. അതു കിട്ടുന്നതാണ്‌വളരെ വിചിത്രം . വരുമാനത്തിന്റെ അടിസ്ഥാനത്തില്‍ 80 % വരെ യാണ്‌ സാധാരണ മോര്‍ട്ട്ഗേജ് കൊടുക്കുനത്. ഹൈ ലെന്‍ഡിങ് ഫീ എന്ന പേരില്‍ അമിത ഫീസ് വാങ്ങി പല കമ്പനികളും 90 -95% വരെ മോര്‍ട്ട് ഗേജ് കൊടുക്കാറുണ്ട്. നോര്‍തേണ്‍ റോക്ക് അതു 120 % വരെ ആക്കി. ആരുഷിക്കു തലയില്‍ ആള്‍താമസമുണ്ടെങ്കില്‍ ഈ വിധം എത്ര പണം അനധികൃതമായി ബാങ്കുകള്‍ ഉണ്ടാക്കി എന്നു മനസിലാകും . അത്യാര്‍ത്തിയുള്ള ബാങ്കുകള്‍ അങ്ങനെ പണമുണ്ടാക്കി. അതെല്ലാം തകരുകയും ചെയ്തു.
സമ്പദ് വ്യവസ്ഥയില്‍ നിയന്ത്രണങ്ങള്‍ ഉണ്ടാക്കുന്നതിനെ ആരുഷിയേപ്പോലുള്ള ആളുകള്‍ എന്നുമെതിര്‍ത്തിരുന്നു. ഇന്‍ഡ്യയും നിയന്ത്രണങ്ങള്‍ എടുത്തുകളയുന്ന തിരക്കിലാണിപ്പോള്‍ .

സോഷ്യലിസ്റ്റ് സമ്പദ് വ്യവസ്ഥയില്‍ ഈ നിയന്ത്രണം എപ്പോഴുമുണ്ട്. അതു കൊണ്ട് ആര്‍ക്കും മുതലാളിത്ത വ്യവസ്ഥയില്‍ കളിക്കുന്നതുപോലെ കളിക്കാന്‍ പറ്റില്ല. സ്വകാര്യ വത്കരണം അടിസ്ഥാന മന്ത്രമയി കരുതുന്ന അമേരിക്ക ഇപ്പോള്‍ പല ധനകാര്യ സ്ഥാപനങ്ങളും ദേശസാല്‍ക്കരിക്കാന്‍ പോകുകയാണ്. അതിനു നീക്കി വെക്കാന്‍ പോകുന്ന സംഘ്യ ഞെട്ടിപ്പിക്കുന്നതും . 700 ബില്ല്യണ്‍ ഡോളര്‍ . ഇത് ഇന്‍ഡ്യയുടെപൊതു മേഘലാ സ്ഥാപനങ്ങള്‍ എല്ലാം കൂടെ അവയുടെ പ്രവര്‍ത്തനകാലം മുഴുവനും ഉണ്ടാക്കീയ നഷ്ടത്തിന്റെ എത്രയൊ ആയിരം ഇരട്ടിവരും . ആരുഷിയേപ്പോളുള്ള മുതലാളിത്ത മതിഭ്രമക്കാര്‍ എന്നും നികുതി ദാതാക്കളുടെ പണം ഇങ്ങനെ ചെലവഴികുന്നതിനെ എതിര്‍ത്തിരുന്നു എന്നോര്‍ക്കുക. ജനകീയാസൂത്രണത്തില്‍ പണം അനാവശ്യമായി ചെലവഴിക്കുന്നു എന്നൊക്കെ
പറയുന്നത് ഇതുമയി താരതമ്യം ചെയ്യുമ്പോള്‍ ഒന്നുമല്ല.
അഴിമതി പടിഞാറ്വ്യവസ്താപിതമാണ്.

അവിടെ ഒരു ലോണിന്‌ അപേക്ഷിച്ചാല്‍ അതിനു കൊടുക്കേണ്ട വിവിധ ഫീസുകള്‍ വളരെ വിചിത്രമാണ്. അപേക്ഷിക്കാനൊരു ഫീസ്. അപേക്ഷ സ്വീകരിക്കാനൊരു ഫീസ്. അറേഞ്മെന്റ് ഫീസ് എന്ന ഒരു സ്പഷ്യല്‍ ഫീസ്. പിന്നെയൊരു ട്രാന്സ് ഫെര്‍ ഫീസ്. ഇനി ലോണ്‍ നേരത്തെ അടച്ചാല്‍ അതിനൊരു ഏര്‍ളി റിപെയ്മെന്റ് ഫീസ്. ഈ ഫീസുകളെല്ലാം ബാങ്കിലെ ജോലിക്കാര്‍ വീതിച്ചെടുക്കുന്നു. ഇതൊന്നുമൊരിക്കലും പടിഞ്ഞാറിന്റെ അഴിമതി എന്ന ഗണത്തില്‍ വരില്ല. ഇന്‍ഡ്യയിലൊ വേറെ ഏതെങ്കിലും പട്ടിണി രാജ്യത്ത് ഒരു ഉദ്യോഗസ്ഥന്‍ 100രൂപ കൈക്കൂലി മേടിച്ചാല്‍ അതു എന്തോ ഭൂകമ്പം പോലെ ഇവര്‍ വിളിച്ചുപറയും .

ഇനിയിപ്പോള്‍ ബലികൊടുക്കാന്‍ ആരെങ്കിലും വേണമല്ലോ. കറുത്തവരാണെങ്കില്‍ വളരെ എളുപ്പം . പാവപ്പെട്ടവര്‍ക്കും കറുത്ത വര്‍ഗ്ഗക്കര്‍ക്കും ലോണ്‍ കൊടുത്തു. അവര്‍ ക്കൊന്നും തിരിച്ചടക്കാനുള്ള പാങ്ങില്ല എന്നെല്ലം ഇനി വിലപിക്കാം . പക്ഷെ ഇവര്‍ക്കൊക്കെ വാരി ക്കോരി ലോണ്‍ കൊടുത്തവരൊന്നും ഒരിക്കലും കുറ്റക്കാരാവില്ലല്ലോ. മുതലളിത്ത വ്യവസ്ഥിതിയില്‍ സമ്പത്തിക കുറ്റത്തിന്‌ ഏതു വെളുത്തവനെയാണ്‌ശിക്ഷിച്ചിട്ടുള്ളത്. സ്കൂട്ടര്‍ ലിബ്ബിയെ തടവില്‍ നിന്നും രക്ഷിച്ചതു ബുഷു തന്നെയല്ലേ?

Baiju Elikkattoor said...

HA HA HA....... ARUSHI, VALLATHUM PUDI KITTIYA.......?

Anonymous said...

Hello folks, Looks like none here has any idea about the American economy. There is nothing drastic happening. This is how the market learns and corrects. In 1930 the banks didnt have insurance for the depositers money. After the 1930 crash, the Govt insured the depositers money upto 100K. A new regulation was created. After this there will be new regulations and the banks will be back on their feet. All this catastrophe people are writing is just for the 700$ billion bail out. Thats all. Of course it is tax payers money. All Governments run on tax payers money. Capitalism or Communism.
The thing is the new bailout plan gives the Govt ownership. That means when the market swings back, Govt gets profit and it can redistribute to the public in tax cuts. Thats all. This happened as recent as 1987.

Of course American economy is the mother of all capitalist economies.
You dont call communist
"economies" since communism doesnt create 'economy' rather it creates a different ideology.

Now the subprime mortgage crisis. It is not that people are on the streets without homes. People made millions in dollars with this subprime just like the wallstreet.
i.e. You have a house you purchased for 10 rupees. When the housing boom started, the same house value tripled. That is it became 30. So the banks allowed the people to take out the 20 rupees without selling their homes. So with that 20 ruppes, people bought new houses, second vacation homes, and some splurged that money. And then now their houses lost the profit. i.e the market corrected and the house value came down to 15. People started to walk out of the houses refusing to pay the loans. thats all. So thats subprime mortgage crisis in simple laymans terms.

Now there is of course people who didnt do wise financial decisions affected and lost homes. They are not a "lot". That happens in any market. Even in Kerala people lose homes after a wedding of their daughter since they splurged too much. Thats all. Those number are always minimal. No Govt can help them.

Anonymous said...

Thanks anony for this valuable (in other ways not so easily available) piece of interpretation. Poor Thomas Isacs, Baiju Elikkottors , Forums Prabhath Patnaiks, Jayathi Ghoshs. Anamgaris, Kalidaasans. I strongly feel that this anony is none other than the Federal Reserve chief.

So thanks Sir.

Baiju Elikkattoor said...

Anony, the economist, will please read this news item?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7585696.stm

Aarushi said...

The current credit crisis will come to an end when the overhang of inventories of newly built homes is largely liquidated, and home price deflation comes to an end. That will stabilize the now-uncertain value of the home equity that acts as a buffer for all home mortgages, but most importantly for those held as collateral for residential mortgage-backed securities. Very large losses will, no doubt, be taken as a consequence of the crisis. But after a period of protracted adjustment, the U.S. economy, and the world economy more generally, will be able to get back to business.

The above is opinion of Federal bank chief, I believe that, because Americans knows how to take care of crisis, Fan of 1930 was worst than this one, only fools like who reside in slums under a huge sky scrapper can laugh when the Sku scapper is falling down, without thinking that the skyscrapper is going to land on his head.

I dont know who started calling American economy as mother of all economies, just read that. But none so far said anything about Russian economy, Hungarian economy, or Checkoslovakyan economy, but of course Chinees Economy is flourishing great, after they adopted liberalisation because they curb any protest against liberalisation in the bud itself. They dont conduct Bandhs, harthals, and bharath bandhs and governemnt wont allow it. Here we are against anything new or progressive. They are not seeing real estate shares like DLF Shobha Developers came down due to American Imapct, still they laugh on American economic problems and dont think that we may also get affected by that.

I have many friends and relatives in different parts of USA, they are confortable, they dont see any problems like the picture Bajiu linked there, I am not against poor or downgraded. But tax payers money should not be given freely to such people who can earn 300 per day but drink for 400 and claim that they are poor, where as I easrn 250 per day and spend 150 and save 100 for investment and educate my children for their better future, limit my life to affordable level, do not spend on boose, but I will be called 'boorshwa' and the bloody drunkard who beat his wife and children after taking 400 worth booze but always ready to hold red flag as and when instructed from AKG centre.
Sorry folks, that ideology will definitely fail, today or tomorrow when Govt can no more affoard such expenditure.

kaalidaasan said...

Every body who can think independently knows how US economy works. It is controlled by crooks, cheats, speculators, cartels and corporate businesses. People who do not have a hollow in their upper story know many things drastic is happening. That is why the US Congress wasted more than a week to discuss plans to rescue their economy. Even now a concrete rescue plan is not decided. 700 billions US Dollars is going to be spent to nationalize the collapsed and collapsing banking crooks. Nationalization is exactly opposite of what capitalist economy stands for. State ownership is the hallmark of Socialist economy. Is it not funny to see capitalist economy adopting Socialist methods to correct the maladies of its own economy?

Arushi and anonymous just dismiss this as self correction. Self correction is an absurd term. It is not self correction,. It is forced correction by active intervention of the govt pumping 700 billion dollars of tax payers money. Only a idiot will refer this as self correction. Self correction is allowing the market to correct by itself. It may lead t0 collapse of many banks and institutions. It is better to correct yourself by using correct term to refer to this stupidity.

And they project China adopting liberalization. Just be seeing a few SEZs these ill informed has decided the China adopted liberalization. But they fail to see how much the Capitalist economy of US adopted many socialist principles for survival. Pure capitalist economy is in compatible with modern times and civilization. So it adopted many socialist principles to get a human out look. The biggest example is the friends of Arushi working in USA with fixed working hours and minimum wages.

US politics, economy and social life are controlled by corporate magnates. That is the tragedy of US economy. Politicians do not have any significant roll there. Speculators determine the fate of US economy. Can any body say who over estimated the value of houses there? Speculators? Who was responsible for the recent oil price hike? Speculators. When speculators are allowed to control your fate, these things will repeat time and again.

Aarushi said...

Suppose I agree all the points raised against Capitalist economy, but what right Mr.Thomas Issac possess to wriet such an article?

1) Has he even doen anything for the poor,downtroden in any of his three budgets?

2) It was Capitalist boorshwa K.M.Mani who introduced Agri labour pension? What Mr.Thomas Issac did for poor in Kerala?

3) Its the abkaris' and bar hotel owners who control economy and financial matters of LDF Govt In kerala. What Mr. Thomass Issac did for poor?

So he has no right to laugh at American economical issues.

kaalidaasan said...

So aarushi’s issue is not what Thomas Issac wrote, but his right to write that. That exposes aarushi to his/her core. I do not ask questions like ,What is your right to question Kerala’s economy. What you have done to Kerala’s poor and rich?

Issac commented on US economy. If you have something to say about that, write those here. US economy is going through the worst crisis in its entire history. Since majority of world economy is tied to US economy , they will have to face some difficulties. India may also get affected. BPO may be dealt a blow. And IT based industries also may face many problems. Kerala had ignored and still ignoring traditional industries and agriculture. So this should be an eye opener for Kerala. Those who say that if IT is not here, Kerala will be a desert should learn a big lesson form this crisis.

Anonymous said...

Dear Arushi
It so happened that Shri Kunju Mani happened to be the finance minister during 1980-82 through whose Budget the pension for agricukural workers was introduced. He was presenting a budget on behalf of LDF. Never before or after he could bring any such thing for poor. This is the fact. Do you know how many budgets Shri Kunju Mani had presented?

Engane chirikkaathirikkum aarushee ee thamaaSa keetu?

Anonymous said...

kaalidasan
who gave you the idea america is a 100% capitalist economy? america has long been a mix of both.

guess which economy is a 100% capitalist economy? hmm.. it is hongkong. ah! controlled by?

Anonymous said...

kaalidasan and friends
What I am saying is, you guys are trumpeting here as if it is the
end of America and her economy. As if you are waiting for a Soviet like fall. That my friends will never occur.
Kaalidasan, please englighten me why a so called nationalization
completly failed in Soviet Russia?
If America is controlled by crooks
and not politicians, what happened to Soviet Russia? What is happening in socalled nationalized China? See, the sad thing is here is you are not realising the crooked days of nationalization is over everywhere. It wont happen
anymore. Please come back to your senses.

If American economy fails and
crashes, China just is on the path
of its molten lava. So dont blow your trumpets so loud.

Anonymous said...

Unlike Soviet, people are not on the streets asking for food.That folks is the strength of America and her economy. People have freedom to make or break. It is not the corrupt fatty politicians who order them to breathe or poop.

Anonymous said...

ഗൂഗിള്‍ ഇമേജസില്‍ great depression എന്നത് സെര്‍ച്ച് ചെയ്യുക. ആളുകള്‍ ഭക്ഷണത്തിനും ജോലിക്കും ഒക്കെ ക്യൂ നിന്നിരുന്നത് കാണാം..

Anonymous said...

that was in 1930 my friend. please.
the whole world was undergoing a lot of changes. Even the Russian revolution was just 13 years old.

America is still a great country for people who love democracy and freedom. Dont fume and fret on that.

Sorry to say, what you are wishing for America wont happen at least now. Your joy is short term.

Baiju Elikkattoor said...

"America is still a great country for people who love democracy and freedom. Dont fume and fret on that."

Dear Anony,

I believe you aren't joking. You seem to be so fascinated by the so called greatness of America. I would request you to read this book written by Howard Zinn, a great American himself (http://www.historyisaweapon.org/zinnapeopleshistory.html), and tell me what greatness you find in their history (if ever they had one
!).

Infamous Napalm bombing on innocent people in Vietnam (forgot that young girl running for life!); subverting the elected governments in Latin American countries; more than 500 failed attempts on the life of Fidel Castro; ruining the great Mesopatomian culture in the name of WMD and killing poor Afghans almost daily in the name of terror on war (just a few examples) are counted as their greatness, then execuse me my dear!

And "democracy and freedom"! You don't have to seach anywhere else. The American hand behind the Vimochana Samaram against democratically elected EMS ministry has been established now behond any doubt. The Guantanamo and Abu Gharib jails are still there as the shining examples of American concept of freedom...!!

Earlier Anony said...

No one is wishing american people anything bad. Only describing the situation in the U.S. There are lessons to be learnt for us from the present episode. One can either agree to the arguments or present his points. Instead running to the erstwhile soviet union for cover, is escapism. Just to show how shallow is this argument, a mention about the great depression period was made.

If arushis have not read the last speech of Mr.George Bush, let them read that first and list out the depressing words and phrases he uses in the speech. It will be a good eye opener.

kaalidaasan said...

Anonymous,

Where did I say that America is 100% capitalist? America long ago accepted many Socialist principles. That is why it is attractive to others. Its economy is a mixed one similar to India. I was not discussing abut that either.

I was talking about what Isaac commented. Middleman speculating and liquidating business establishments is a feature of true Capitalism where the motto is to make money in what ever dubious way you feel like. That is the reason for BPO as well. This business owned by US rich do not contribute US economy. That is why it is stagnant and now in recession. The money earned from BPO and of shore establishments directly go the bank accounts of a few. And USA is facing that . When economy becomes stagnant crooks resort to speculation. That lead to unusual raise in house prices. None of the so called enlightened ever enquired the reason for the unnatural rise in house prices. I fact the authorities celebrated it as a growing economy. The speculators made handsome money and that bubble just burst.

ലോക്കല്‍ കുട്ടപ്പന്‍ said...

സോറി. ബ്ലോഗ് മാറിപ്പോയി. വര്‍ക്കേഴ്സ് ഫോറത്തിന്റെ മലയാളം ബ്ലോഗ് ആണെന്നു കരുതി കയറിയതാ. സായിപ്പിന്റെ കാര്യം സായിപ്പിന്റെ ഫാഷയില്‍ സംവാദിക്കുന്നത് തെറ്റല്ല കേട്ടാ. നമുക്കൊന്നും പുടികിട്ടീല്ലാന്ന് മാത്രം.

Anonymous said...

Baiju
Howard Zinn, a great American himself -- thats the point my friend. Howard Zinn wont exist in Soviet or China.

U.S has shrewd foriegn policies that causes lot of disaster around the World But give me one country which doesnt have.

If you go by digging the past history of countries, U.S will look angelic compared to Soviet or Europe.

The funny thing is, people who pray of the failure of U.S doesnt care for the poor? People
who are happy at the crisis,
doesnt care for the poor? Or an
american poor is different? Hypocrisy galore!


"There are lessons to be learnt for us from the present episode."
Yes this is true. One can learn lessons about regulations in market. Investors can learn how not to burn the fingers. But human greed has short term memory, or this wouldnt have happened.

Anonymous said...

This business owned by US rich do not contribute US economy. That is why it is stagnant and now in recession. - kaalidasan, my friend, you are wrong and i am sorry about this misinformation you have. The fuel of U.S economy is 90% small business. Rich people in U.S is only 2%. All those evil kaalidasan you are writing is true for any country. Not only capitalism. China is now facing domestic credit crisis. Govt regulated banks and business make the crooked politicians or the powerful richer and the economy stays stagnant for decades. They dont even offer a choice to normal people.

The interest rates were kept artificially low that shot the housing prices up. People knew for long this was a bubble and this would happen, so many got out making money. Some didnt (greed) or couldnt (stuck). This is not a shock or surprise. If you check U.S economy history, this is nothing new. You are too premature in your celebration.

U.S Economy is all about freedom and innovation. There is no stopping them. It is the free human spirit.

kaalidaasan said...

Anonymous,

Anonymous is misinformed. No body trumpeted here as if it is the end of America. But US economy is in dire straits and US authorities are trying hard to rescue it. That is why they are planning to pump in 700 billion Dollars as a rescue effort. If they do not nationalise the debts of the failing banks, US economy may fall. If markets can get corrected by itself, nobody will waste 700 billions Dollars to buy the debts of failed banks.

Why nationalisation failed in USSR is not the issue. It is US economy adopting Socialist method of nationalisation to correct the wrongs of Capitalist set up. If nationalisation is not good, why should USA resort to that. Why not jus leave the failed banks tm heir natural death. The issue is the intervention to rescue economy.


USSR disintegrated not because of economic problems. It was decision by its president. And US sponsored western style economy was injected into that economy. Crooks controlled USSR economy for sometime. Many oligarchs looted its assets. They have either fled to west or are behind bars now. After Putin took over the mantle he brought back the USSR style controls more vigorously. Now Russia is bouncing back.

Nothing special is happening in China. It is true they established a few SEZs. They had 200 a few years ago. They dismantled majority and they have around 50 now. Whether crooked or not, days of Nationalisation is not over. That is why US now thinks over nationalising the failed banks. UK have already nationalised the Northern Rock. Now it is doing that in recently failed Bradford and Bingley. You should come to your senses to see these truths, rather than advising others. If nationalisation does not work, then Bush and Brown are super idiots as per your assessment.

If US economy fails, Chain follow suit, may be a wishful thinking. If US economy fails , it is their fate. And few economies like UK which is behaving as another state of USA may follow suit. Even the European economy may not be affected too much. Indian economy will be affected marginally. The soap bubbles created after 1991may burst. Basic Indian economic structure is Nehruvian Socialism . And it will not fail in the near future. If US economy fails , China may have to dismantle US companies established in a few SEZs. China’s major business is with African countries. And China exports cheap goods to USA. At a time of recession, US citizens will opt for cheap goods, only, not the costly ones form Japan. USA is just one customer for China. Even India is big market for China. So your dream may not come true in the case of China. And I really wonder why you drag USSR, Russia and China into this issue.

China holds around 1.5trillion Dollars as foreign currency reserve. Do not try to compare that economy with debt immersed US economy.

Whether people queue on streets for food in USA is not the issue now. The lean politicians of USA will avoid that. Like attacking Iraq, they will resort to attacking Iran and Pakistan.

kaalidaasan said...

അനോണിമസിനു വേണ്ടി ചൈനയില്‍ സം ഭവിച്ചത് തഴെ കൊടുക്കുന്നു. മധ്യമം ദിനപത്രത്തില്‍ വന്ന ഒരു ലേഖനത്തിലെ ചില ഭാഗങ്ങളാണിത്.



ചൈനയുടെ അനുഭവം അവഗണിക്കാനാകുമോ?

ചൈനയിലെ സോണുകളുടെ 'അഭൂതപൂര്‍വമായ വിജയ'മാണ് ഇങ്ങനെയൊരു നയം ഇവിടെയും സ്വീകരിക്കാന്‍ കേന്ദ്രസര്‍ക്കാറിന് പ്രചോദനമായത്. 2005ല്‍ നിക്ഷേപകര്‍ക്ക് സഹായകമാകുംവിധം പ്രത്യേക സാമ്പത്തിക മേഖലാനിയമം കൊണ്ടുവരാന്‍ പ്രചോദനമായതും ചൈനതന്നെയാണ്. രാജ്യത്തിന്റെ കയറ്റുമതി വര്‍ധിപ്പിച്ച് കൂടുതല്‍ വിദേശനാണ്യം നേടുക, വികസനത്തില്‍ ഏറെ പിന്നാക്കം നില്‍ക്കുന്ന തെക്കന്‍ കടലോരപ്രദേശങ്ങളെ പുരോഗതിയിലേക്കു നയിക്കുക എന്നീ ലക്ഷ്യങ്ങളോടെ 1980ലാണ് ചൈന ആദ്യത്തെ സോണ്‍ സ്ഥാപിക്കുന്നത്. ഗ്വാങ്ഡോങ് പ്രവിശ്യയിലെ ഷെന്‍ഴെന്‍ സോണ്‍. 3,27,000 ഹെക്ടര്‍ ഭൂമിയാണ് ചൈനീസ് സര്‍ക്കാര്‍ ഇതിനു വേണ്ടി ലഭ്യമാക്കിയത്. വേര്‍തിരിക്കപ്പെട്ട ചില മേഖലകളില്‍ മുതലാളിത്തം പരീക്ഷിക്കുകയും അതിന്റെ പ്രത്യാഘാതങ്ങള്‍ മറ്റിടങ്ങളിലേക്ക് വ്യാപിക്കാതിരിക്കാന്‍ പരവമാവധി ശ്രദ്ധിക്കുകയും ചെയ്യുക എന്ന രീതിയാണ് തുടക്കത്തില്‍ കൈക്കൊണ്ടത്.

ഷെന്‍ഴെന്‍ സോണിലൂടെ കയറ്റുമതി വര്‍ധിപ്പിക്കാന്‍ ആയതോടെ സര്‍ക്കാര്‍ സോണുകള്‍ക്ക് പരമാവധി പ്രോത്സാഹനം നല്‍കി. 55 സോണുകള്‍ സര്‍ക്കാര്‍ തന്നെ സ്ഥാപിച്ചു. ഇതിനുപുറമേ നിലവിലുണ്ടായിരുന്ന ഭൂവിനിയോഗനിയമം ഭേദഗതി ചെയ്ത് സ്വന്തമായ ഭൂനിയമങ്ങള്‍ ഉണ്ടാക്കാന്‍ തദ്ദേശ സര്‍ക്കാറുകള്‍ക്കും പ്രവിശ്യാ സര്‍ക്കാറുകള്‍ക്കും അധികാരം നല്‍കി. എണ്‍പതുകളുടെ മധ്യം വരെ ചൈനയില്‍ ഭൂമി പൂര്‍ണമായും സര്‍ക്കാറിന്റേതായിരുന്നു. നഗരങ്ങളിലെ ഭൂമി സെന്‍ട്രല്‍ ഗവണ്‍മെന്റിന്റെ നേരിട്ടുള്ള ഉടമസ്ഥതയിലും ഗ്രാമങ്ങളിലെ ഭൂമി വില്ലേജ് കമ്യൂണുകളുടെ ഉടമസ്ഥതയിലുമായിരുന്നു. നഗരഭൂമിയുടെ വിനിയോഗാവകാശം മാത്രമേ നിയമപ്രകാരം കൈമാറാന്‍ അനുവാദമുണ്ടായിരുന്നുള്ളൂ.

സോണ്‍ജ്വരം മൂര്‍ച്ഛിച്ചതോടെ തദ്ദേശ സര്‍ക്കാരുകള്‍ ഒന്നിനു പിറകേ ഒന്നൊന്നായി ഇത്തരം മേഖലകള്‍ക്ക് അംഗീകാരം നല്‍കിത്തുടങ്ങി. കൃത്യമായി രേഖപ്പെടുത്താന്‍പോലും കഴിയാത്തവിധം സോണുകളുടെ എണ്ണം പെരുകി 1993 ആയപ്പോഴേക്കും 8000^ലധികം സോണുകള്‍ നിലവില്‍ വന്നുവെന്നാണ് ഏകദേശ കണക്ക്.

സോണുകള്‍ക്കു വേണ്ടി ഭൂമി ലഭ്യമാക്കാന്‍ സെന്‍ട്രല്‍ ഗവണ്‍മെന്റ് ഗ്രാമപ്രദേശങ്ങളിലെ ഭൂമിക്ക് നഗരഭൂമിയുടെ പദവി നല്‍കുകയും വിനിയോഗാവകാശം സ്വകാര്യകമ്പനികള്‍ക്ക് കൈമാറുകയും ചെയ്തു. 1985നും 95നും ഇടയില്‍ 15,00,000 ഹെക്ടര്‍ ഭൂമി സര്‍ക്കാര്‍ ഈവിധത്തില്‍ കൈമാറി. ഭൂമിക്കു ക്ഷാമം വന്നതോടെ സര്‍ക്കാര്‍ കര്‍ഷകരെ ഒഴിപ്പിച്ച് വന്‍തോതില്‍ കൃഷിഭൂമി സോണുകള്‍ക്കു നല്‍കിത്തുടങ്ങി. ദേശീയവും തദ്ദേശീയവുമായ പല നിയമങ്ങളും ലംഘിച്ചാണ് പല സോണുകളും പ്രവര്‍ത്തിച്ചത്.

സങ്കുചിതമായ സാമ്പത്തികസൂചികകള്‍ വെച്ചുനോക്കുമ്പോള്‍ ചൈനയിലെ പല സോണുകളും വിജയം തന്നെയായിരുന്നു. പ്രത്യേകിച്ചും ഷെന്‍ഴെന്‍ സോണ്‍. ലോകത്തിലെ മറ്റൊരു നഗരത്തിനും നേടാനാകാത്ത സാമ്പത്തിക വളര്‍ച്ച കൈവരിക്കാന്‍ ഈ സോണിനു കഴിഞ്ഞുവെന്നത് സത്യം തന്നെയാണ്. 20^30 ശതമാനമാണ് സോണിന്റെ സാമ്പത്തിക വളര്‍ച്ചനിരക്ക്. ഇന്ത്യയില്‍ നിന്നുള്ള മൊത്തം കയറ്റുമതിയുടെ കാല്‍ഭാഗത്തില്‍ കൂടുതലാണ് ഈ സോണില്‍ നിന്നുമാത്രം കയറ്റുമതി ചെയ്യുന്നത്.

എന്നാല്‍ സാമ്പത്തികമായ ഈ നേട്ടങ്ങള്‍ക്ക് സാമൂഹികമായി കനത്തവില നല്‍കേണ്ടിവന്നു. പ്രവിശ്യകള്‍ക്കിടയില്‍ സാമ്പത്തിക അസമത്വം വര്‍ധിച്ചു. കര്‍ഷകര്‍ കൂട്ടത്തോടെ കുടിയേറ്റ തൊഴിലാളികളായി മാറി. ഷെന്‍ഴെന്‍ സോണില്‍ താമസിക്കുന്ന 120 ലക്ഷം ജനങ്ങളില്‍ 70,0000 ലക്ഷം പേരും കുടിയേറ്റ തൊഴിലാളികളാണ്. അധ്വാനത്തിന്റെ വില പരമാവധി കുറച്ച് നിക്ഷേപകരെ ആകര്‍ഷിക്കാന്‍ സോണുകള്‍ മല്‍സരിച്ചു. തൊഴിലാളികള്‍ പരമാവധി ചൂഷണം ചെയ്യപ്പെട്ടു. സ്വതന്ത്ര തൊഴിലാളി യൂനിയനുകള്‍ ഇല്ലാതിരുന്നിട്ടുപോലും 2006ല്‍ മാത്രം ഇവിടെ പതിനായിരത്തോളം മിന്നല്‍ പണിമുടക്കുകള്‍ നടന്നിട്ടുണ്ട്. സോണുകള്‍ പെരുകിയതോടെ ബാലവേല വര്‍ധിച്ചു. ഷെന്‍ഴെന്‍ സോണില്‍ മാത്രം 5,00,000 കുട്ടികളാണ് ജോലി ചെയ്യുന്നത്. തൊഴിലാളികള്‍ക്കിടയിലുളള ആത്മഹത്യാനിരക്കും വളരെ കൂടുതലാണ്. സാംസ്കാരിക വിപ്ലവകാലത്തു നേടിയ സാമൂഹികനേട്ടങ്ങളില്‍ നിന്ന് ചൈന ബഹുദൂരം പിറകോട്ടു പോകുകയാണ് ഉണ്ടായത്.

തൊണ്ണൂറുകളുടെ അവസാനമായപ്പോഴേക്കും സെന്‍ട്രല്‍ ഗവണ്‍മെന്റ് ആകെ അങ്കലാപ്പിലായി. ഭൂവിനിയോഗത്തില്‍ മാറ്റം വരുത്തുന്നതിന് 1997ല്‍ ചൈന മൊറട്ടോറിയം ഏര്‍പ്പെടുത്തി. കൂടാതെ 1998ല്‍ കൃഷിഭൂമി സംരക്ഷിക്കുന്നതിനുള്ള നിയമവും കൊണ്ടുവന്നു. ആയിരക്കണക്കിന് സോണുകളുടെ അംഗീകാരം റദ്ദാക്കി. ഔദ്യോഗികമായി ഇപ്പോള്‍ 56 ദേശീയ^സാമ്പത്തിക^സാങ്കേതിക വികസന സോണുകള്‍ മാത്രമാണ് ചൈനയിലുള്ളത്. കൂടാതെ കയറ്റുമതി സംസ്കരണ മേഖലകളും. സോണുകള്‍ക്കു നല്‍കിവന്ന നികുതി ഇളവുകളും ചൈന പിന്നീട് പുനഃപരിശോധിച്ചു. എത്രതന്നെ അടിച്ചമര്‍ത്താന്‍ ശ്രമിച്ചാലും ഭൂമി നഷ്ടപ്പെട്ട കര്‍ഷകരുടെ പ്രക്ഷോഭങ്ങള്‍ ചൈനയില്‍ വര്‍ധിച്ചു വരികയാണ്.

Anonymous said...

USA is just one customer for China. -- Please kaalidasan, please. We both know this is not true, then why say this? U.S is the biggest customer of China, Iraq, Saudi etc. Once the U.S
consumer thinks they dont want Chinese products boom goes China.
U.S can shift its factories to Mexico if China increases a cent.
The factories in China previously existed in Mexico, lest not forget.

U.S bailed out Freddie and Fannie or Chinese banks would have gone kaput. Please compare the GDP's before we even make a comparison.

1.5trillion Dollars as foreign currency reserve -- yes, U.S DOLLARS. :)

Earlier Anony said...

“If you go by digging the past history of countries, U.S will look angelic compared to Soviet or Europe.“

could you elaborate?

Your arguments about poor people, as somebody said earlier, is stupid and absurd. It is true that they will be affected. But, the same people who allowed things to worsen this much are now telling us that if public money is not channeled to save the biggies, poor will suffer. These poor people were here for all these times, when the BIGS were playing in the markets. Didn't see them?

Anonymous said...

http://disorderedorder.blogspot.com/2008/09/blog-post_29.html

kaalidaasan said...

I think anonymous completely misspelt what I wrote. I used the word this to refer to the new BPO and off shore business done by US entrepreneurs. During the past two decades there is not much new business in USA. US business growth is stagnant at 1% now. All new establishments by US businessmen are either BPO or in SEZs of other countries. This does not contribute to the economic development of US.

How many rich people are there in US is not an issue at all. They may be 2% or even less. But richest 10% of families own 85% of all outstanding stocks, about 85 % of all financial securities and 90 % of all business assets in USA. The proposed 700 billion bail out plan is addressing this rich people.

The middle class are not going to be affected at all by this bail out. It's something that is going to affect the very wealthy. Changes in the stock market won't make much difference to the middle class. It is to help the rich recover from the stock market collapse.

The interest rates were kept artificially low that shot the housing prices up, is just another stupidity from your side. If that was so the remedy for that was not further lowering interests rates. US federal reserve lowered the interest rates unprecedentedly for many months. But the house prices did not come up. So such analysis won’t have any significance. People knew for long this was a bubble and this would happen, so many got out making money, is another gem. So only people knew this and owners of banks and mortgages did not know this truth and they paid 100% and 120% of house value as mortgages with a sure knowledge of not getting those back. Only 11 percent of subprime loans went to first-time buyers last year. The vast majorities were refinancing that caused borrowers to owe more on their homes under the guise that they were saving money. Many borrowers were talked into refinancing their homes to gain additional cash . They made money which they did not deserve. As you said, this is not a shock or surprise. And this is nothing new in US economy. People make undeserving money at the expense of the state. That is the absurdity about this shoddy drama.

Authorities know this , bankers know this, people know this. Yet they allow this to happen time and again. That means they allow crooks and cheats to make huge profit out of this ever repeating absurdity. A couple decades of deregulation have allowed people at the top of the financial food chain to benefit from millions of people, through unscrupulous mortgage lending practices

U.S Economy is all about freedom and innovation. The freedom to loot public money in the guilt of rescue. Corporate business know this truth very well. They loot in billions and millions, and allow ordinary people to loot in lakhs . There is the very helping govt to pump billions of dollars of taxpayer’s money to rescue them.

Who is losing? CEOs of large U.S. companies last year made an average of 10.5 million dollars, while the top 50 private equity and hedge fund managers pocketed an average of 588 million dollars each. Secretary Paulson amassed a personal stock stash worth over three-quarters of a billion dollars as the CEO at Goldman Sachs. This happens due to the result of capitalism's fatal flaw, insatiable greed in a rigged system that rewards a few at the expense of most others.

There is no stopping them. It is not the free human spirit. It is the free spirit envisaged by Milton Friedman’s "free market" Chicago School fundamentalism. That is well described in his famous book , "Capitalism and Freedom" and taught it to students for decades. He believed that government's sole function is to protect our freedom both from enemies and from our fellow-citizens. Preserve law and order. Enforce private contracts. Protect private property and foster competitive and unregulated markets. Everything else in public hands is socialism and not to be tolerated. Free markets work best. Unaffected by rules, regulations, or taxes, trade barriers, entrenched interests, and human interference. Business does better, so let it. The best government is one that governs least. Public wealth should be in private hands.Govt should allow nrestrained accumulation of profits. Corporate taxesand social services to be abolished. Economic freedom an indispensable means toward political freedom.

Yet 18 percent of U.S. children lived in poverty in 2007.


This Began after Chicago School economics took hold under Ronald Reagan. Continued under Bush Sr. Became religion under Bill Clinton, and ultimately fundamentalism under Bush Jr. The largest bank failure in US history was Washington Mutual's collapse. Earlier it was giant insurer AIG. Before that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, Lehman Brothers, Bear Stearns. Merrill Lynch had a forced liquidation to Bank of America.

700 billion dollar bail out is just a down payment. Trillions will be needed in the end. The problems are deeper and more intractable than anyone expected. Before this ends, unimaginable amounts of capital will be written off, too much to even contemplate. Bush concluded that "democratic capitalism is the best system the world has ever devised" in spite of clear evidence that it's broken and corrupted. It exploits people for profit, enriches the few at the expense of the many, rewards criminals for their crimes and protects the rich from beneficial social change.

And people like anonymous , whithout knowing what really happens sing another halleluijja for this absurdity.

kaalidaasan said...

Anonymous,

I know that US is not the biggest customer of China. You are free to think that US is the biggest customer of China. It is EU. US imports from China is almost equal to the imports from Canada and not far behind is Mexico. Even Indian markets are flooded with Chinese goods.

If U.S consumer thinks they don’t want Chinese products, nothing big will happen to China. US consumer has to shell out more money to buy dearer products. That is all.

US can shift its factories from China . But that will not affect Chinese trade with other countries. China is not trading those made in US factories alone.

If US did not bail out Freddie and Fannie, Chinese banks would have gone kaput, is another absurdity. Not only Freddie and Fannie, but many others were bailed out. China does have holdings in many US banks as securities. But that is not any way detrimental to Chinese economy.

Comparing GDP’s does not have any bearing in a stable economy. If GDP was the indicators for these, US govt should not have run from pillar to post to rescue an ailing economy.

Yes 1.5 trillion US dollars. It was because US dollar was the main currency for international trade. Now it has shifted to Euro. What is the fun in China having a foreign currency reserve in Yuvan?

Do you have an idea what will happen if China release half of its 1.5 trillion Dollars to international market?

Anonymous said...

Out of all you wrote, this was a laugh riot.

"It was because US dollar was the main currency for international trade. Now it has shifted to Euro."
Even with IMF data, the dollar forms 65% of the currency of international trade and Euro is only 25%. So from where are you getting all these numbers my friend?

India, huh? Please. Indias trade volume with China is just a mere 24,where as the U.S export volume stands at a humongous 232 as of 2007. My friend, U.S is still the major importer of Chinese goods. Please dont say "Europe". That way you can club a lot of countried and can say Asia, Latin America etc. U.S is a single country and it is the largest buyer for around 60 countries not only China. Now if you add Chinas trade deficits with Taiwan and South Korea, it would add upto the Chinda trade surplus it has with U.S. So please let us be realistic here about China. This is not the old World order, where you can spread misinformation and can get away with it. I really dont understand what harm is there if you just say the truth just as it is?

Kaalidasn you can froth all you want, but sorry to inform you again. Europe, China, Japan etc. all are export oriented economies depending on the mighty U.S and her dollar to buy. Where as U.S is not an export oriented economy. It is only less than 20% of her economy.

It is like asking what if Saudi refuses to sell oil to U.S? What will happen? They cannot drink oil. Thats the same silly question you are asking about what if China releases its foriegn currency to the World Market? It is give and take in trade.

This is what Peter Morici had to say about it.

If the peoples Bank of China were to sell enough Treasury securities to disrupt financial markets and cast the U.S. economy into recession, where would China's factories sell all their stuff? Where would all those Chinese living in cities work if their stuff does not move? What would they do with their time if they were laid off? Oust their government? Riot in the streets? The Chinese Communist Party can make effective threats to disrupt the U.S. economy only if Americans are stupid enough to panic.


Now Kaalidasan my real intention is not an argument with you. But it is to inform readers who are wise enought to judge. It is high time we stop the lies and misinformation spreading in public and I am doing what an active citizen should do. I think with these readers will get a good idea for further reading and research. Thanks.

Baiju Elikkattoor said...

"It is high time we stop the lies and misinformation spreading in public...."

Anony,

"lies and misinformation" as far as your comments are concerned, this observation seems to be fine!

kaalidaasan said...

Anonymous,

Even with IMF data, the dollar forms 65% of the currency of international trade and Euro is only 25%. So from where are you getting all these numbers my friend

Trading is in monetary zones and a currency zone is regarded as a single entity. International trade is not a balancing act. It is for profit. And profit is considered in terms of money. You are fee to break it on any geographic zone.


A data of yester years does not hold god today. You are free to believe any previous data. It was this year Iran and Venezuela, two of world’s biggest oil exporters decide to switch over to Euro from Dollar. China is now increasing the Euro trade rather than Dollar.

Regarding US imports and exports, you can check official US site

www.census.gov



Kaalidasn you can froth all you want, but sorry to inform you again. Europe, China, Japan etc. all are export oriented economies depending on the mighty U.S and her dollar to buy.

You can have grandiose hallucinations like Europe, China, Japan etc. all are export oriented economies depending on the mighty U.S and her dollar to buy. But others do not have any thing such that. You are free to believe that these countries survive by exporting to USA. I do not want to disrupt that dream. That exposes your notion about economy.


But the fact of the mater is , China do have business relations with most countries of the world, unlike USA. They do have manufacturing and construction business in Africa, ignored by USA and Europe.

From 1970s to 2006 exports to Japan surged from 1.4% to 18.5%, that to USA from 0% to 12.5 %.and to EU from 0.6% to 8.9%. After that the exports to EU has overtaken that to USA. This you can read here.
http://www.imf.org/external/np/speeches/2006/030706.htm




It is like asking what if Saudi refuses to sell oil to U.S? What will happen? They cannot drink oil. Thats the same silly question you are asking about what if China releases its foriegn currency to the World Market? It is give and take in trade.

I do not have too much clay in my head to ask questions like if Saudi refuse to sell oil to USA. If that happens USA will be oil deficient and Saudi will be oil surplus. USA will look for oil in other parts including Iran and Venezuela.


Vehicles all over the world uses mainly oil. If USA does not want Saudi oil, they will not drink it or shut down oil fields. They will export oil to other countries, even if it is cheaper than US price.. Your entire thoughts and life are revolving around USA. That is why this sort o hallucinations.

But you asked a similar question what will China do if US consumers refuse to buy Chinese goods. If they refuse China will sell their goods in other parts of the world, may be at a cheaper rate.

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2008-07/11/content_6836266.htm

The EU remains China's largest trade partner, followed by the US. The trade between China and India is increasing the fastest among China's major trading partners. The bilateral trade stands at $29 billion, up 69 percent.



At the moment China can sell consumer goods at half price offered by Japanese companies. And Chinese goods are steadily becoming cheapere in US market compared to goods from other countries.



http://www-wds.worldbank.org/external/default/WDSContentServer/IW3P/IB/2008/05/27/000158349_20080527092730/Rendered/INDEX/wps4628.txt

Indeed, between 1997 and 2005, average prices of goods exported from

China to the US fell by an average of 1.5 percent per year whereas the average prices of these

products from the rest of the world to the US increased on average by 0.4 percent per year.


It is up to the US consumers to spend more on non Chinese goods.


That can not be equated to what will happen if China release 1 trillion Dollar to world markets. The result will be a crashing of US Dollar. Whether China does that or not is, another question. China holds that money not to crush US Dollar, but as an effective weapon, to twist its arms..

Now Kaalidasan my real intention is not an argument with you. But it is to inform readers who are wise enought to judge. It is high time we stop the lies and misinformation spreading in public and I am doing what an active citizen should do. I think with these readers will get a good idea for further reading and research. Thanks..


You started arguing with the current economic issue in USA and the comments by Issac. This post does not even mention about that, but concentrate on Chinese trade. Readers can easily understand why yo have ran away from that issue.

I am not arguing with you. I was stating a few facts. Definitely readers will judge.

Chinese exports are mainly to Japan, US and EU. If US stops importing, China will compensate that with increase to Japan, EU, India and Africa


http://news.tradingcharts.com/futures/6/8/114261686.html

Of China's foreign trade of electronic and information manufactures, solely foreign-funded enterprises have accounted for a comparatively big proportion in recent years, but their import and export growth has slowed and proportion has shrunk. The import and export of joint ventures have maintained a stable growth trend, those of private enterprises posted a rapid increase, and the import of state-owned enterprises slowed while their export growth expanded.

Moreover, Hong Kong, U.S.A, and Japan are the top three importers of electronics and information products produced in China, and re-import is the foremost import source.


.

http://www.imf.org/external/np/speeches/2006/030706.htm


1970 1980 1990 1995 2000 2002 2003
Japan 1.4% 3.1% 5.1% 10.7% 14.5% 18.3% 18.5%
USA 0.0% 0.5% 3.2% 6.3% 8.6% 11.1% 12.5%
EU 0.6% 0.7% 2.0% 3.8% 6.2% 7.5% 8.9%


http://www.reportbuyer.com/countries/asia_pacific/china/china_import_export_forecast_report_2007.html

In 2006, the export value was USD 791.61 billion, In 2006, China's exports to America had a total value of USD 203.47 billion. Exports to EU had the value of USD 181.98 billion..

Anonymous said...

If US stops importing, China will compensate that with increase to Japan, EU, India and Africa

- haha! EU - is not a single country. U.K and Netherlands are the main countries who are getting stuff from China. Please China cannot 'compensate' by selling anything. Those countries need to have money to buy stuff. Thats how it goes kaalidasan. It is not like Oh U.S wont buy our stuff, then let all that stuff go to some other country? I gave you the trade volume of U.S and India which is not even comparabale. It will take years before India or UK reach the consumer levels of U.S. It is a plain fact.

(I invoked China and Russia only because, the issue of nationalization came up. Those countries are exemplary examples of nationalization)

U.S is not Utopia. It's policy is freedom, democracy and free market economies(upto an extent). It will have its trouble and tribulations of course. But unlike totally nationalized economies where the Govt can just spend half their economy without a question from the public, on building weapons and the later go bankrupt like Soviet, it wont happen in U.S. Since people have the basic freedom, they have freedom to choose, they have the free spirit to believe in their country, they have the free spirit to build their country. Nothing can compensate that and is uncomparabale kaalidasan. Of course with freedom and choice comes mistakes and irresponsibility. Even with this 700billion bailout, the tax payer would have to pay additional 3000 dollars as taxes/year, which they will get back as tax cuts later when the banks make profit. No big deal kaalidasn, honestly.

They will come up with new regulations for investment banking,
but then someone will have a great new idea and then there goes all the rules and regulations. Thats the beauty of free market economics. It is hard for people like you to understand since you want the Govt to spoonfeed everything at the cost of your personal liberty. That my friend is not America.

Anonymous said...

You can have grandiose hallucinations like Europe, China, Japan etc. all are export oriented economies depending on the mighty U.S and her dollar to buy.

-- Kaalidasan, this is not my hallucination. See the problem is your hatred of everything U.S.A is making you state lies which are totally untrue. That Europe,China, Japan are export oriented economies,and U.S is their major buyer a child will know. But for you thats a hallucination.
I am not revolving around U.S. but sorry to state you are. I am just stating the plain facsts everybody who even had an iota knowledge of economy has. But you are refusing to see it. I dont know in 25 years time, what will be the status. But this is how it is today.

China even took U.S's second place as the largest exporter. Germany stands first in export. Even though U.S has now the third place in Export, U.S economy is huge that it only comes to less than 20%of its total economy. Thats not the case with Germany, Sweden, China etc.

Whats the point in even having a conversation when you are denying the basic facts for your hatred towards a country? Chalo, you can have a roll! Who cares?

Anonymous said...

Now U.S will go down only when her innovation goes down. She is the leader in innovation and technology which others adapt and the Chinese factories are eager to produce and mimic. For innovation, you need freedom. You need free spirit and free thinking. That my friend doesnt come easy in other parts of the World.

(An excercise for you: Write down the list of modern technology related things that you use daily and write the country which orginally innovated it)

Adios.

kaalidaasan said...

Anonymous,

Nobody said that EU is a single country. Who told you that UK and Netherlands get the major share of stuff from China. They should have money to buy. I did not know that US is minting money for EU.

US have an export share of under 15% from China. If US do not buy Chinese goods, they will definitely sell those somewhere else. Like USA, India is also a consumer state. Chose export was 0 in 19070s to USA. It increased. Like that the trade with India is now 69bilion US $. If China wants it can increase that to any level. It may take years.

Russia and China are exemplary examples of nationalisation. Because they followed a Socialist policy. Now USA uses that Socialist policy to tide over a big crisis. It is simply because Capitalism does not have a solution for the current crisis.

US is not a Utopia. Like that all other countries including China , Russia etc are also no utopias. All has their own problems. China was lectured by US, relentlessly on the weakness of its banking system. But China's success has been based on its consistent contempt for Western advice and it is not Chinese banks that are currently going bust. Yesterday Chinese astronauts take a spacewalk while the US Treasury Secretary is on his knees.

But US free market economy favours the rich and they looted public money, to derail the economy of a country. And govt is trying to rescue the economy by using Socialist method of nationalisation. With the nationalisation of crucial parts of the financial system, the American free-market creed has self-destructed while countries that retained overall control of markets have been vindicated. And the stupidity is, the cheats and looters are not getting punished, but tax payers are made to pay for the loss. That is why it is being opposed by common men in USA. Whether 3000 or 3 Dollars, these money is being utilised to rescue the ailing banks. None of the people who lose homes will get any money. That s the absurdity which you are unable to grasp.


Paulson and Bush want the US taxpayer to buy Wall Street’s worthless private debts. They. falsely claim that failure to bailout the Wall Street swindlers will lead to the collapse of the financial system. In fact, almost 200 of leading US economists from the most prestigious universities reject Paulson’s bailout. The truth of the matter is that withholding funds to Wall Street will lead to the collapse of the swindler-speculator-run financial system, which created the current economic debacle. And US people will be freed from this stupidity. Instead Government can and should use that public money to establish a national, publicly controlled banking and investment system subject to oversight by elected representatives. That is the meaning of democracy. What we see in USA now, is thugs and cheat keeping elected representatives as hostages at gun point. Public funds invested in manufacturing, construction, education and health care leads to products with real use value and has a multiplier effect on the rest of the economy instead of ending up in the pockets of billionaires who speculate and invest in mergers and overseas buyouts. These weeds has to routed out. Then only there will lasting stability. When these failures do occur , people like you colour those with self correcting bandana. This happened many times and decorations did not solve the problem.

This is a system that forces corporations to expand its market and increase profits by reducing costs, or risk being consumed by another. This form of global cannibalism, or global capitalism, has forced those companies , to move from country to country looking for the cheapest labour and the most lax government control. Speculative capital, which is often described as investment capital, has become the main source of wealth for those seeking to make money from money.

Each day half a million to a million people, arise as dawn reaches their part of the world, turn on their computers, and leave the real world of people, things, and nature, to immerse themselves in playing the world's most lucrative computer game: the money game.
America’s productive economic base is disappearing. Even the weapons and armament for U.S troops is outsourced to other countries. US people are told, productive work is for the poor of other counties, as Americans we can make our money off money.

There is no point in coming up with new investment regulations and banking. These regulations are features of Socialist economy. That is why such unscrupulous looting is not in Socialist economy. Socialist economy do put curbs on personal freedom. But the way US put curbs on its people is known after 91. They do have more freedom in economic filed and the whole world now see where that freedom landed the ordinary US citizens. USA was borrowing on a colossal scale to finance tax cuts and fund its overzealous military commitments. Now, with federal finances critically dependent on continuing large inflows of foreign capital, it will be the countries that spurned the American model of capitalism that will shape USA’s economic future. Countries that buy large quantities of American bonds, China, the Gulf States and Russia, may to continue supporting the dollar's role as the world's reserve currency or may see this as an opportunity to tilt the balance of economic power further in their favour? Either way, the control of events is no longer in US hands. The type of capitalism , laissez-faire ,which is peculiar and highly unstable variety , has imploded. USA can not continue this any more.

Power is slipping from US hands. Georgia has shown that Russia can redraw geopolitical map, while USA was a mere spectator.

In America system govt spoon feed the greedy thugs who loots and cheats. Now Bush and his cronies are seeking permission to spoon feed these criminal with a spoon full of 700billion $. In other economies govt spoon feeds the needy, not the greedy. You are free to prefer the first. But I prefer the second.

kaalidaasan said...

Anonymous

See the problem is your hatred of everything U.S.A is making you state lies which are totally untrue. That Europe,China, Japan are export oriented economies,and U.S is their major buyer a child will know..

I do not have any hatred towards USA. I simply stated that USA is not the only consumer in the world. But you try to disprove that. That is why you ask stupid questions like, what will China do if USA stops buying Chinese goods and what will Saudi do if US stops buying oil. If USA stops buying goods from out side, the world will not end tomorrow.

I am not a child to say that US is the major buyer from Europe, China and Japan at the same time. Majority of goods consumed in USA is bought from out side. China has got more trade with EU , than USA. It has got an appreciable level of trade with Japan . It is increasing its trade volume rapidly with India and African countries. So asking a Utopian question like what will China do if US stops buying goods is childish.

I am not revolving around US, but you are. That is why you try to ask Utopian questions and conclude that China and Saudi will collapse if US stops buying oil and goods.

Today’s realities are.

China holds 1.5 trillions US Dollars as reserve money

China has more trade with EU than USA.

Chinese goods are becoming progressively cheaper in US markets and non Chinese goods are costlier.

China is progressively increasing its trade with India , Japan and African countries.

USA may have the largest economy. But it is ailing. It oldest banks have gone bust. I needs a total revamping. Baling out greedy thugs will not rescue the economy. It needs positive attitude.

Whether you like it or not, these are the realities which US economy and world economy faces today.

After crooks like M Sing took over India’s reign, India is being tied to US tail. That is how India got a few SEZs , BPO and other out sourcing dramas. It helped many IT people getting lucrative salary and better life. But the number of poor people are also raising.

Baiju Elikkattoor said...

Thank you Kaalidaasan. You have explained very well although prejudiced minds cannot accept it anyway!

Bush is also an economic thug rather than a politician.

kaalidaasan said...

Anonymous,

Now U.S will go down only when her innovation goes down. She is the leader in innovation and technology which others adapt and the Chinese factories are eager to produce and mimic. For innovation, you need freedom. You need free spirit and free thinking. That my friend doesnt come easy in other parts of the World.

That is a stupid question. Innovations will shift with time. For that you should know history. When Europe was in dark ages and nobody knew about USA, India and East was the centre of Civilisation and innovations. The number Zero is India’s contribution. Then it was Arabia, then Europe. When migrants grabbed US land and created an artificial country there, they needed people to do work. So scientists and technocrats migrated to USA and they developed. Until WW2 , USA was insignificant. Thereafter with crookedness and , manipulation and power, they dominated world. Now that domination is coming to an end. The innovation and other things will now shift to other countries. China and India are developing on great pace. These may take over the reins from USA and Europe in the future. Only a real idiot will live in a dream that US domination is ever lasting. You have the free spirit to live in the dream. But world around you are changing. Whether you realise that is not my issue.

(An excercise for you: Write down the list of modern technology related things that you use daily and write the country which orginally innovated it)

I will give you another exercise. Just type down the following names in Google and search. You will know these names are the innovators of many machines and utilities including the machine on which you type your US hymns.


Faraday
Edison
Marconi
Paul Gottlieb Nipkow
John Logie Baird
Joseph Marie Jacquard

ഗുപ്തന്‍ said...

China , cuba viatnam and bangal,thripura,kerala in India are developing on great pace. These may take over the reins from USA and Europe in the future.

Anonymous said...

See Kalidasan this is the problem, you are still living in the past. Those names you gave me is like the sanghis telling India invented 0. I was telling you U.S will last its economic poweress as long as she is top in innovation and technology. This you have to understand clearly. You cannot deny this and this innovation and migration of people (exactly) comes from her democracry and freedom. Thats what attracts her to millions of people who is eagerly waiting to migrate to U.S.
From the Linus Trovald to a Murdoch, everybody is vying for U.S citizenship exactly due to this freedom.

In U.S you dont need a family name, a caste name or a religion to come up in life. Anyone can. A nobody can just work hard, a college drop out can work hard, an orphan can work hard and as long as they work hard they can be anything from a top biollionare to a President. This is the charm of U.S which no other country to date has offered. Once this freedom sets in, of course other countries will get the brains. But sadly, almost all countries have too many internal rifts and problems and no solution is even seen in the horizon.

If US do not buy Chinese goods, they will definitely sell those somewhere else. --
Kaalidasan many of your arguments are quite childish. China is not making these products at their will. It is that U.S comapanies like Wal-mart and JCPenny or Dell have factories there. Once these companies shift factories from there if they want to say Mexico (there was recently somme movement towards this, due to the high oil prices, China lost its competitive advantage), it can happen in 6 months and China will turn poor in 6 months flat. A company like Wal-mart can setup factory in Mexico or any other country in 6 months. China's economy is that closely tied to U.S. The thing is without you even realising this basic and simple fact, howmuchever you try to argue, it will come across as pure childish and blind. Arguments should be based on facts, not ideology or pure ego.

U.S of course will lose its sheen, there is no question about it. What I said, is this is not that day and I am sorry to burst your bubble. I too dont like a unilateral power. What U.S did in Iraq is only due to it being the only super power. That of course should end, but I dont see any near country reaching that in another 25 years. China is 25 years behind U.S in everything. Remember you cannot flex your muscles like the old Soviet.

You are very much wrong when you say nationalist banks do not have any problems. Looks like you need to brush up your history on nationalization and socialsing economies. Of course what happened to Lehman wont happen to a nationalized bank. Thats like comparing apples and oranges. Both are two different set of economies. Remember 1990 with the so called socialisation India was going to go bankrupt. We were forced to open up our economies and free market. You blame corruption for that and that is exactly what I have to say too.
If you have an iota of memory , you should know the corrupt politicians and the businessmen had a roll in Indias regulated economy. Everybody else stayed poor while the babus made a lot of money. Thats the major evil happening to regulated closed economies. Indias license raj put India a 50 years backward when we were the 4th largest economy in 1947. People had no power or say and we were the laughing stock with the term hindu-rate of growth during those times with absolute zero investment. That is what happens in nationalized economies. You cannot just plough the land and live in these days, please come to your senses. You are outdated an astounding 20 years.

Either the politicians steal from nationalized economies or the greedy sherlocks steal from free market economies. But for a country to grow and innovate, there must be free market upto an extent and some form of last resort Govt regulation not a purely nationalized economy.

Socialist economy do put curbs on personal freedom -- haha! You would really need to know what freedom is my friend. Thats the problem. A woman in purdah too thinks she has the freedom until she comes out of it. Thats the sad state of myopic vision of some of you guys who speak in same tone for economy.

Of course U.S, Soviet were the new World Order after WW2. If not for U.S, the WW2 would have not come to an end. -- face those facts, friend. And yes the so called Soviet empire crumpled because it didnt take care of its poor and the general public. A country which doesnt take care of its citizens will one day crumple. And that is exactly why America wont.


Baling out greedy thugs will not rescue the economy. It needs positive attitude -- Of course, that thing about positive attittude, U.S has in plenty. You should have seen the markets surge back , the third largest, even with no bailout plan. No economists say the 700 billion bailout is bad. But what they say is they are not sure whether that will really clean it up.

"Until WW2 , USA was insignificant. Thereafter with crookedness and , manipulation and power, they dominated world." -- hahaha. Thanks for a good laugh. U.S.A was not insignificant, it was the country where people where rebels fled to, to make a living. It was the country where democracy was in full play, it was the country who did not colonise any other country. U.S.A came to power cause of the Soviet empire burst. Sorry, I kinda feel there are people still licking at those wounds and thats why the smile on our Chief Minister's (who should be barred from office just for his old age alone) face. Sad state my friends, if this is way ideas are thought up.

Georgia has shown that Russia can redraw geopolitical map, while USA was a mere spectator. - Ah! Caught you there. So thats the REAL
problem. When there are big tears for colonisation, there is no tear for Russias growing muscle. So you would need U.S to go down so Russia (she is no more communist) can flex her muscles. But sorry my friend, Russias economy is now not even near to South Koreas. They wil catch up, Russians are good, but it will take a helluva lot of time. You would have to wait to have the party.

50th Anony said...

"In U.S you don't need a family name, a caste name or a religion to come up in life. Anyone can."

This is the same slogan capitalism puts forward. Anyone can become a millionaire or a President. But it does not tell us that in that system how the majority will be surviving. And Obama is yet to become the first black president. Mrs. Clinton was unlucky to lose the chance to become the first woman president of U.S. And we need not talk about the racial prejudices in the U.S. Please ask "Google Grannie" and she will tell you who constitute the majority of U.S poor(Oh Mummy! is there anything like that?)

Regarding Iraq, it is not just a cruel act. We have to understand that imperialism can not and will not survive without such acts. Some one has to pump "fuel" to make it survive, or it will forcefully take hold of somebody else's "fuel". So just saying that I am against U.S invasion of Iraq, and supporting imperialism on all other fronts, is simply stupid. First one has to understand how imperialism (and capitalism) works. Regarding nationalization of banks, let anony brush up his memory or go through the state of affairs before nationalization. From 1947 to 1969 the banks weren't nationalized. So will the anti nationalization campaigners take the blame for pushing India down from its "4th position"? Further India is not a closed society, politically or economically.

"If not for U.S, the WW2 would have not come to an end."

Thanks for giving us a gauge to see how you arrive at "conclusions." :)

Anony, do you really believe in the usages like 'democracy in full play', 'the country who did not colonize any other country' ? Better read how colonization happens in the era of imperialism. You needn't to be THERE to colonize, friend. Regarding other slogans anony is repeating, one can tell that the U.S P.R Department has done its job marvelously to make people believe the lies, half truths and misinformation.

Anonymous said...

Regarding Iraq, it is not just a cruel act. -- Of course, None has any doubt Iraq is not just a war, but it is Americas dirtiest imperialist tricks. And yes, we were there 10 million of us chanting slogans against war. It wouldnt happen in nationalized countries like Soviet or China.

Oh Please dont sermon on Obama being black. Nowhere else would a black man come this far. In India, the woman and the lower caste have no freedom and most of the lower caste live like animals. So please.
There is no other country where people are treated like that other than in India in this century.

Of course there is rampant racial prejudices in U.S. Remember U.S is not Utopia, but there are equally strong laws in U.S against discrimination against color or nationality or sex. Almost all criminals who has hurt a black has been awarded death sentence promptly. (I am reminded of 15 delhi upper caste men who lynched a dalit for skinning a cow. Where are they now?) Thats what you call law and order in a country. You dont escape with political clout for that. That is what you really call democracy. Sorry you are not aware of that. Democracy is not majority voting. Democracy is equal participation of the citizens and voting process is just the start of it.

Anonymous said...

This is the same slogan capitalism puts forward. Anyone can become a millionaire or a President. But it does not tell us that in that system how the majority will be surviving. -- Equality is also what communism puts forward. But it never happens and the system rots in itself. For equality communism demands utter discipline from its citizen, your brains and your body belong to the Govt, you libery and freedom is squashed. Yet, there is no equality. How is the majority living in U.S? Pray tell me?

kaalidaasan said...

Anonymous,

I am not living in the past. You are not living either in the past or present, but in some hallucinations.
India gave zero to the world. It is not a thing of the past. It is the reality. Without zero, maths is a big zero.

USA may attract many businessmen mainly due to tax issues. None of the corporate giants in US pay tax. There is not wonder Murdoch is attracted to that perverted system.
The democracy you boast about US is absurdity. It is a stagnant stupidity where only less than 50% voters vote. The reason being, whoever gets elected the system does not change. It is because USA is not ruled by elected representatives, but by mafia. Whether it is Clinton, Bush , Obama or Mac Cain, these are just ceremonial entities. Whether its is democrat or Republican, the policy of USA is same. So people do not fancy voting. That is why US democracy is stinking.

You are exposing your ignorance about FDI in China. That is why you have absurd hallucinations like, if US companies shift from China, China will turn poor in 6 months. Chinese economy is not tied to any other economy. You do not have any idea about the FDI in China and how much is US share in that. So to learn about this, reading this link

http://www.uschina.org/info/forecast/2007/foreign-investment.html

And base your arguments on those truths.


In 2006, China maintained its position as one of the world's top destinations for foreign direct investment (FDI). Foreign-invested enterprises (FIEs) play a large role in China's economy, accounting for 27 percent of value-added production, 4.1 percent of national tax revenue, and more than 58 percent of foreign trade. According to the PRC press, .companies from 190 countries and regions have invested in China, including 450 of the world's Fortune 500 companies. By the end of 2005, FIEs in China employed more than 24 million PRC citizens.

According to findings in the USCBC's 2006 Member Priorities Survey, a majority of US companies report that they primarily invest in China to serve the Chinese domestic market, not export back to the United States. UBS AG estimates that the total share of US, European, and Japanese multinational corporations (MNCs) in Chinese exports is only 11 percent--most exports are from Hong Kong, South Korean, and Taiwan firms. Further, UBS estimates that 75 percent of Western and Japanese MNCs are in China to sell to the domestic market.

Top foreign investors

The top sources of FDI into China in 2006 remained largely unchanged from previous years (see Table 4). Hong Kong continued to lead the list, followed by the British Virgin Islands, Japan, South Korea, and the United States. Taiwan, Singapore, the Cayman Islands, Germany, and Western Samoa rounded out the top 10.
Investment growth from Japan, South Korea, and the United States slowed in 2006, but overall FDI has been buoyed by inflows routed through Hong Kong and the British Virgin Islands, which jumped 13 and 25 percent, respectively. In fact, Hong Kong and the British Virgin Islands together accounted for more than 42 percent of

Table 4: Top 10 Origins of FDI*
*Note: Does not include financial sector flows.
Source: MOFCOM
Country/Region of Origin Amount Invested
2005 ($ biliion) Amount Invested
2006 ($ billion)
Hong Kong $17.95 $20.23
British Virgin Islands $9.02 $11.25
Japan $6.53 $4.60
South Korea $5.17 $3.89
United States $3.06 $2.87
Taiwan $2.15 $2.14
Singapore $2.20 $2.26
Cayman Islands $1.95 $2.1
Germany $1.53 $1.98
Western Samoa $1.36 $1.54




If you have some sort ofense in you, it will teach you that US is far behind four other countries in FDI in China. US has an investment of half of Japanese investment. And US investment is steadily decreasing. So your big lie that China will become poor
if US withdraws investment fall flat.


If you need more information about Chinese economy readthis link as well.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_the_People's_Republic_of_China

kaalidaasan said...

We were forced to open up our economies and free market.

Yes we were forced to open our economy and markets. The WB stooge M M Singh opened it. And all our traditional industries and agriculture crumbled. We had a very good production of quality tea, coffee, cardamom, pepper, ginger etc. After opening up, cheap crops from various parts of the world were dumped in India destroying what ever we had. Many farmers comitted suicide as well.

Recently this very same crook gave subsidy to imported palm oil. He also purchased wheat from USA and Australia giving more price than in Indian market. Whose interest this anti national criminal is serving? Definitely not Indian interest. There is no wonder that a ran away US worshiper singing hosanna for USA and US interests.

would really need to know what freedom is my friend.

I know what freedom is where it can take you. USA had full freedom and it got the nice slap like 9/11. Such freedom is dangerous as the whole world sees now. Comparing that with freedom of women in pardah is absurdity.

yes the so called Soviet empire crumpled because it didnt take care of its poor and the general public.

USSR crumbled not because it did not take care of its public and poor. But due to some other issues. After USSR collapsed, western style of freedom and democracy were injected into Russia. After thugs looted its wealth and fled to west, Russian people realised their folly and now they are happy with Putin’s Russia with more regulations and controls than in USSR era. They have shown that they do not want western style freedom and democracy. So they chose a former KGB agent as their leader, who rules Russia with a iron hand.

.A was not insignificant, it was the country where people where rebels fled to, to make a living.

Yes it is true. It is an artificially created entity,mass murdering the original inhabitants. Rebels from all over the world fled to that area and lives there. All those who fights against any govt is welcome in USA. The biggest one such was the recently died Solzhenitsyn. According to him USSR was bad, but USA is worst.

When there are big tears for colonisation, there is no tear for Russias growing muscle.

Russia did not grow muscle anywhere. Russia did a tit for tat in Georgia. In the name of self rule , USA fragmented Yugoslavia and USSR. Even a tiny bit like Kosovo was made an independent country. Russia played the same game. Russian majority Ossetia was supported to become an independent country by Russia. USA encouraged Georgia to send troops to Ossetia and got a nice drubbing by Russia. USA could not utter a single word other than the routine rhetoric. Such things may be repeated all over the world with USA as similar spectators. The so called mighty USA is waging two losing battles in Iraq And Afghanistan. US army is pounded left and right in those areas. And these two events had contributed to the crumbling of US economy. And there is no end to that either.

kaalidaasan said...

Oh Please dont sermon on Obama being black. Nowhere else would a black man come this far. In India, the woman and the lower caste have no freedom and most of the lower caste live like animals.

So in all African countries and majority third world countries, still white men is ruling!!!!

India elected KR Narayanan , a dalit as its president. Now Prathibha Patil is India’s president. The most populous state of India, UP is now ruled by a Dalit woman. Indhira Gandhi was India’s PM decades before USA started selecting women as VP candidates.

Of course there is rampant racial prejudices in U.S. Remember U.S is not Utopia, but there are equally strong laws in U.S against discrimination against color or nationality or sex.

Nice contradiction, my dear friend.

If there is rampant racial prejudices, what is the fun in having strong laws? That itself shows that the law is a super failure and proves that your so called USA is a utopia.

Democracy is equal participation of the citizens and voting process is just the start of it.

When did women start voting in USA? When did black got equal rights in USA?

How is the majority living in U.S? Pray tell me?

As hostage of a bunch of crooks and criminals, lead by a liar called Bush. When this criminal told them that there were WMDs in Iraq, these majority swallowed that .

Apart from making money, they do not have any aim at all. And those rebels from all over the world come there. But people, ,like you went there to make money. That is why you ditched your own mother land and opted for another country. India do have similar freedom and a more vibrant democracy. But you rejected that and opted for the money USA can offer.

Anonymous said...

kalidasan
you are unbelievably hilarious. Especially your last comment is a masterpiece and should be filed under comedy.

Okay, now when you have time left after spewing venom, try to look how and which companies are there in Hong Kong and British Virgin Islands? Hmm. Can they be companies registered in those countries to evade taxes? Hmmm..Interesting? HongKong is governed by whom? Hmmm. Food for thought. Now let us move on to Japan and reasearch on what exactly is Japan producing in China and Japan is traditionaly and export-oriented economy. So whos buying all that Japanese stuff? Hmm?

In that case, Haliburton (which is a die hard U.S company) which is a major player in having an Iraq war is registered in Dubai. Does that make Dubai company actually part of the war in Iraq or a U.S company? Or take the case of Accenture (which is one of the Big 5 in U.S) is registered in Caribbean. Does that make Accenture a Caribbean company?

Think kaalidasan think. I understand you are having trouble
attaching together all this data and facts. but thats okay. it takes time.

Now please dont pick the first link you see in Google. Internet is a vast information world, where you are supposed to read at least a 100 links before you come up with conclusions like what you wrote.

Anyway, I am glad you could spit out all that hatred from your heart by having this conversation. We will do this often so you know you become healthier and happier in life.

Anonymous said...

That is why you ditched your own mother land and opted for another country. - Tsk Tsk. My heart breaks and it is bleeding. The last adavu eh? :D

Sorry to say kaalidasan, I love material comforts, a 21 inch TV screen, a 19 inch monitor for my computer, a good house and a good car. Sorry I wont be settled for parippuvada and beedi anymore.

Or I would trade in all these for a stay at the new Five Star Hotel or even a day at the Water Theme park? Howdy bro? Deal? eh?

;)

Baiju Elikkattoor said...

Kaalidaasan,

Leave this anony, who seems to have lost the subject. He is hoping from Wall Street to Hong Kong to Japan to Iraq to Dubai to Caribbean(?). Let him have a parippuvada and beedi and come to his sense.

വിലാസിനി അമ്മാള്‍ said...

Think kaalidasan think.

kaalidaasan said...

Anonymous,


For all normal human being Hong Kong is part of China. It has some economic independence. Just because a few US companies are there in these areas, doe s not make them US. India does have many US companies and European companies. People of your wavelength may include India as part of US and Europe. And you can file this as well in your comedy collection and laugh daily.

Japan isexporting to almost all countries. India do buy a lot of Japanese products. It includes, TV, Computer, Radio, Cars, Washing machines and a lot of others. If India stops buying Japanese products, Japan will not disappear. Like that if USA stops buying Japanese or Chinese goods, these countries will not disappear. Since you are a blind worshiper of USA, you can have any sort of hallucinations.
Iraq was attacked not by any company in USA. It was the political leadership under the chimpanzee , Bush who attacked Iraq. Many companies from all over the world is having business in Iraq. Even Indian companies are doing business there. Since you are a small child, you are running frantically from pillar to pillar to prove that US is the centre of the universe. That is why you think that doing business is equal to attacking another country. Grow up man. Just living in USA for Dollars does not make you learned. For that read and learn.

I do not have any problem in attaching ideas. You have problem and that is why you equate doing business to attacking a country. Those are entirely different which your brain can not comprehend.

Forget about the link I picked. You are free to quote any link here to prove that USA has a major stake in Chinese investment. I just challenge you now to show me at least one source which says that USA is the major investor in China. Why do not you do that rather than behaving childish.

I stated only the facts. Unfortunately is not good from a US point of view. Since you are a US migrated Indian, you can not tolerate those. What to do. Truth is truth.

You are free to love material comforts like a 21 inch TV screen, a 19 inch monitor for computer, a good house and a good car. Nobody questioned you for that. There are billions all over the world who can not afford that. Their lives are not any way inferior to yours either. I simply said that majority of US citizens are after these material comforts. For that only they kill millions in various other parts of the world. When they got back a fraction of that , as commented by Rev Jeremiah Wright, the US chickens are coming back for roosting, they all got mad. The after effect is Iraq and Afghanistan. Still you people do not learn anything. Still you are after material comforts for your people. US citizens are the most hated at present al over the world.

We are happy with for parippuvada and beedi we have. So be happy with your adopted country and live there for ever. We will be solving our problems. Whether you stay in a five start hotel or trade anything to see water theme park, it s not my issue. And your can extent the trade to everything your possession as well.
I definitely feel sorry for you. What is your root? Why you think that money is everything in your life. If you are believer in God , just read your scriptures to learn what is the role of money in human life. If you are a atheist, just embrace the material possession.

You remind me of another US worshiper who went to the extent of saying that US gives all technologies to China including to make a pin. Anybody with a little sense will laugh at you people. You are living in a Utopia.

Anonymous said...

കാളിദാസന്റെ വെല്ലുവിളി ആ അനോണിമസ് സ്വീകരിക്കുന്നത് കാണാന്‍ കാത്തിരിപ്പൂ.

Baiju Elikkattoor said...

"You are free to love material comforts like a 21 inch TV screen, a 19 inch monitor for computer, a good house and a good car. Nobody questioned you for that. There are billions all over the world who can not afford that. Their lives are not any way inferior to yours either. I simply said that majority of US citizens are after these material comforts. For that only they kill millions in various other parts of the world. When they got back a fraction of that , as commented by Rev Jeremiah Wright, the US chickens are coming back for roosting, they all got mad. The after effect is Iraq and Afghanistan. Still you people do not learn anything. Still you are after material comforts for your people. US citizens are the most hated at present al over the world."

You said it Kaalidaasan! Absolutely right. Thanks.

I would differ with you. An atheist just can't be materialistic. It is greed, either atheist or believer, that tempts one always to seek the luxury of materialism. Greed the is basic trait of American way of life. It cannot sustain for long...!

Anonymous said...

US citizens are the most hated at present all over the world.

Even if it is true, is it the right way of seeing things? The ordinary U.S citizens have no role in the affairs.

Another doubt is about greed. As the search for "profit and more profit" is the base of capitalism, the present crisis is the crisis of capitalism and it will happen again. But when we put greed as the root cause of the crisis, I feel that we are losing our point. Greed theory in a way suggests that it is not the problem of the system, but that of individuals. And better individuals can make the system work without such hiccups.

Thanks Kalidasan for the comments.

Baiju Elikkattoor said...

No, Mr. Anonymous, ordinary US citizens have a great positive role to play, but unfortunately they are just bothered about their materialistic way of life. And, that is their guilt!

kaalidaasan said...

Anonymous,

The ordinary US citizens have no role in their affairs. That is the tragedy of USA. They are blind fooled by a few crooks. The most absurd thing about ordinary US citizens is, they are unaware of what happens in other parts of the world. Even an ordinary Malayali is much more aware than them. That is why US citizens are easily fooled by their leaders. Or rather they are not interested in knowing realities. Most Malayalis know who is US president. But Bush, while he was the republican presidential nominee in USA did not know who was Indian PM . That is the difference between India and USA.

In the last Parliament elections Democrats promised to withdraw the US army from Iraq. And US citizens gave them a majority in Senate and House of Representatives. But that promise did not materialise. That shows that elected representatives do not have any role in ruling USA.

Greed is the root cause of the crisis. Greedy people gave mortgage to undeserving people to make money. Greedy people, who do not want to pay taxes, shifted economic activities to SEZs all over the world, crippling US economy . And the inevitable happened. That is the main point in US economic crisis.

kaalidaasan said...

Baiju,

I did not comment on atheists in general. I did talk about those Indians who ran away from India in search of comforts. I was talking about them only.

Anonymous said...

Deal Kalidasan,

My point is whether capitalism can function without that "greed"? As "profit, more profit" is the theme of capitalism, I feel that whether people are greedy or not, the capital itself will do all the mischievous things. In other words, people can not stay without being greedy. :)

kaalidaasan said...

Anonymous,
It is better not to generalise by using people in this context.
Capitalism can not function with out greed. That is its draw back. When allowed to make money in by means , greed will come into play. If there are regulations and checks, greed can be controlled. That is how greed is controlled in Socialist set up. In that set up every venture does have a social commitment. Capitalist set up is free of that commitment.
Majority of people do not have greed in their mind. People become greedy because of the circumstances. If uncontrolled as in a Capitalist set up, this greed comes t the fore front and starts controlling everything. India is the best example. Before we liberalised our economy , people were not this much greedy. After 1990s people became more greedy and there are many people who think that making money e is the sole aim in their lives.

Baiju Elikkattoor said...

"Before we liberalised our economy , people were not this much greedy. After 1990s people became more greedy and there are many people who think that making money e is the sole aim in their lives."


You are absolutely correct.....!

kaalidaasan said...

The anonymous who was lobbying for USA vehemently is requested to read the opinion of former US National Security Adviser, Zbigniew Brzezinski here